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  1. #1
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    Default COLT 9MM DOE SMG

    Colt-m603.jpg

    We brought back the Commando, and added several ancillary models such as the Hyena, and now the Panama Special. Continuing with our examination of the AR-15 series I want to examine and discuss the Colt SMG...notably the DOE version. I used one of these when I attended Phil Singleton's High Risk Warrant Service School back in the early 1990s. I was the one non-MP5 guy in class. I also had a chance to use a Colt SMG in another class a few years later. There were a few teams that ran them rather than the ubiquitous MP5 of the era. This was mostly due to already having them in the armory, buying them second hand, or a decided choice to go with platform familiarity if they already had the M16 system.

    My impression of it was favorable, if out of reach for the normal American subject of the era. But perhaps, it is something worth bringing back.

    What I liked, how I would do it, and why.

    It was far lighter and compact than the MP5 I was accustomed to. The controls were those of the AR15 and easy to operate for someone schooled on it. A bit easier to run than the Mp5...IMHO, and I ran the MP5 very well. The weapon I sued was well worn and had been sitting in an armory worn out as it was, for years. One of the magazines it came with was also worn and would not stay in place...but the others were perfect.

    Today, I would build it on either an SBA3 braced lower, or an even more compact, albeit more costly Maxim PDW braced lower. I would set it up with ambi safeties and a Geisselle trigger..or its equivalent. Now here is the biggest contraversy which we will leave for last...I would build it to use the Colt SMG magazine and NOT the Glock magazine. Now close your mouth and keep reading.

    The upper would include the 9mm case deflector, be a flat top, and run a super short M-lok rail. Barrel would be the shortest available..likely between 5-7 inches. No shorter because you need to put that hand somewhere. The flash hider may go away as a 9mm has none...maybe add a QD muzzle unit for a can.

    Of course sights and some sort of red dot system...an RMR would be perfect for such a mini-weapon. With a Maxim Collapsible brace and a sub 7" barrel, this would fit in most laptop bags.

    Now...the reason you skimmed over and ignored everything up to this point...the magazines.

    The Glock magazine is popular, and there is an argument to using them. But my perspective is this. I ran a high end, high dollar, best-of-the-best famous maker 9mm AR a couple of years ago designed to use the Glock happy sticks. I was not happy with the reliability. My UZI with steel mags from the 1950s ran better than this one. I do not believe that the Glock mags are intended for the rough use on an SMG weapon. In a pistol, the use is far less harsh on the magazines and thus we never hear of issues. Used in an SMG...the way SMGs are used properly, the magazines will get beaten up. The feed angle is also optimized for a pistol and not for an SMG, giving rise to the strange rearward angle of a Glock magazine in any long gun.

    The Colt 32 round SMG magazine is a better choice IMHO , and what I would use to build this weapon. They are readily available...well...were readily available before the current panic (justified as it may be). Ammunition Storage Components and Duramag, both make them at very affordable prices, and for range drills, even Promag makes sacrificial magazines. And they can be found in surplus form from time to time.

    There you have it. Perhaps, it will be a "Next Project" from the guys at The SI Q-Branch.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  2. #2
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    Fascinating. I always find it interesting to see how they had to adapt the current technology of the time and likely bureaucratic restraints of forcing their existing hardware into a needed roll.
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  3. #3
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    Gabe,

    I am not really current on my 9mm SMG mags. Does the Colt mag have the same profile and mag catch as the CProducts mag?

    Years ago I picked up and A1 Colt Commando 9mm upper so I was curious.
    I carry two kinds of trauma kits. One for fixing it and one for causing it.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasher View Post
    Gabe,

    I am not really current on my 9mm SMG mags. Does the Colt mag have the same profile and mag catch as the CProducts mag?

    Years ago I picked up and A1 Colt Commando 9mm upper so I was curious.
    CProducts is out of business. ASC and Duramag are making the Colt SMG mags now. Not sure what the C Products looked like.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  5. #5
    I believe Metalform made the original OEM rampant pony colt 20 and 32 rd mags. These had metal followers and were built like tanks. They made 20 as well as 32rd mags - still do.

    Later, colt appeared to go to CP products mags, which had plastic followers and never felt as solid to me. (A subjective judgement to be sure, but at the time I was running both types in a 16" gun, the metal form mags just worked better.

    Your carnage may vary.

    Jake
    Last edited by Jake Salyards; 03-21-2021 at 12:36 PM.
    Wait for the Lord. Behave yourself manfully, and be of good courage.
    Do not be faithless, but stay in your place and do not turn back.
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  6. #6
    20210321_133444.jpg

    4.5" upper
    On colt registered SBR
    9mm flash can
    Wait for the Lord. Behave yourself manfully, and be of good courage.
    Do not be faithless, but stay in your place and do not turn back.
    Thomas Kempis

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
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    Indiana
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    246
    I have a glock mag set up currently. I would love that shortened brace set up. Hopefully you will sell that as a stand alone with the buffer tube and buffer/spring. I would be in for one. I could fit it in my work briefcase then.

    I have a stupid question. If the problem with the glock set up is mainly or only the magazines not being robust enough, could metal magazines be made to stand the abuse?

    Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cody C View Post
    I have a glock mag set up currently. I would love that shortened brace set up. Hopefully you will sell that as a stand alone with the buffer tube and buffer/spring. I would be in for one. I could fit it in my work briefcase then.

    I have a stupid question. If the problem with the glock set up is mainly or only the magazines not being robust enough, could metal magazines be made to stand the abuse?

    Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
    ProMag did awhile back. Don't know about now. I bought one during '41's AWB. It's cheap and nasty.

    There are metal mag releases available, so you'd wear out the mags instead of the catch.
    Warrior for the working day.

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