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  1. #21
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    Feb 2009
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    Twist rate is easy. 1:10. Works great on 147s and up to 175s.
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  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Texas
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    594
    This is timely, as I had been looking to purchase a .308 soon. Top shelf barrel without sacrificing durability, easily set up or convertible to a suppressor host, good trigger, good sling mount options, pistol form factor preferred for portability. To me the commando concept would be a legitimate jack of all trades with portability and precision. I wouldn’t mind some glass options in the SI store, either; this slots in nicely with the variable optics discussions of late.

    <——not a rifle expert by any means

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    4,807
    A brief but related digression:

    endplate.jpg

    Couldn't find what I wanted online, but imagine this with larger slots, all edges heavily rounded/radiused, and a QD at the locator "dimple." I'd throw one on every AR I own.
    Warrior for the working day.

    Es una cosa muy seria. --Robert Capa

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    P:20

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    NWFL
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    16,448
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorkface View Post
    Twist rate is easy. 1:10. Works great on 147s and up to 175s.
    Agree that the twist rate should not be slow. I happen to like the option of being able to use AP and solid copper that are most often a longer bullet for the wt than is a lead core bullet.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    860
    Look at the DRACOS barrels from Falkor. Very light, crazy accurate and they never get hot! The Falkor Petra in 300 Win Mag is only a little heavier than an AR-10, so going down to .308 and a shorter barrel will definitely give a lower weight overall.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    1,331
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Ryder View Post
    Look at the DRACOS barrels from Falkor. Very light, crazy accurate and they never get hot! The Falkor Petra in 300 Win Mag is only a little heavier than an AR-10, so going down to .308 and a shorter barrel will definitely give a lower weight overall.
    Yes but that barrel alone is 800 bucks.
    Aero should be the lower. Great quality for the cost. I also agree on the 16” barrel. It’s long enough to reach out but short enough to be handy. Twist rate should be 1 in 10, anything else will be specialized for the 308. Unless you plan to put a can on it, like it’s required on a 12.5” barrel. If you’ve never shot a 12” .308 indoors, you don’t make any friends at indoor ranges. It’s fucking loud. I couldn’t imagine shooting one inside a structure without ear pro. Barrels from ballistic advantage or for more money, criterion are great choices for the money. Something that should be used is also an adjustable gas block. These are the norm with .308 ARs more so than AR15’s. Midwest industries combat rail for the handguard.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    AR15ONA
    Posts
    435
    Quote Originally Posted by Huntindoc View Post

    Lower should be POF or Aero. Spikes is also good. Milled stripped receivers are awesome but can cost $400-600 by themselves.

    SB adjustable brace.

    -Owning both POF and Aero parts, I agree either would be an excellent choice. I'm slightly partial to POF, if for no other reason simply because it's located in AZ and not WA.

    - I do like the idea of an adjustable gas port as well. Some I've seen allow you to shut off the gas flow and turn the gun into a bolt-action. Could be useful when you don't want to chase down your spent casings...


    Maybe a name for this gun could be the Holliday or Huckleberry?

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Colorado
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    8,454
    Names that have popped into my head: The Ulfberht, Leadcutter or Bowie.
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    HRO-6 CQB: Fighting in Structures
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    TWOTU edition
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    TWOTU since May 2015

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Exiled in Texas
    Posts
    7,483
    I'm in the process of building one of these myself. I got the lower finished before everything went into a drought. Given prices and availability, I put the upper on hold for the moment. (So I'm definitely a potential customer for an upper.)

    DPMS pattern. This seems to be emerging as the standard. A lot of voices have already cast their vote for Aero Precision, and AP follows the DPMS pattern. If the trend continues, every AR10 of another pattern will be obsolete in 20 years, and parts will dry up for those guns.

    Intermediate buffer tube. I strongly favor the A5 receiver extension for this build. This little modification, which adds 3/4" to the rear of the gun, smooths out the bolt cycle noticeably and adds reliability to the system. Someone focused more on precision might even want a full rifle length extension, and I can see an argument in favor of that. The short carbine tube, though, is too unforgiving and not worth it to shave a mere 3/4" off the gun (which most won't even see evidence of, because their stock or brace will add that length back).

    Multiple gas positions. I would really like to see a multi-position gas key that allows you to select for suppressed or unsuppressed use. I realize, though, that this is asking a lot and may not be feasible. In my wildest dreams, the gun would actually have four positions: (1) off (for maximum silence), (2) suppressed, (3) unsuppressed, and (4) adverse. That's the dream. But just having suppressed and unsuppressed would be awesome.

    Adjustable gas block. If the above selector isn't an option, then at least an adjustable gas block. I anticipate this gun being suppressed 90% of the time, so I would like for it to just barely cycle when unsuppressed.

    14.5" barrel with a customer-selected pin-and-weld QD. For my own use, it would be a SiCo ASR, which means I could actually go down to a 14.3" barrel, but 14.5" keeps it a little bit simpler. For uppers alone, you could just sell it as a 14.5. Doing a pin-and-weld at home isn't that hard for many of us. And those who can't do it on their own would gladly drop a C-note to have the device of their choice installed. The 14.5 is a mainstay of the AR15 world, but never got much traction in the AR10 world. But all of the same benefits apply. NFA paperwork is a hassle, but for this gun I would much prefer a real stock.

    1:10 twist. This rifle will probably be eating a lot of heavier bullets, including the occasional sub. A 1:12 is way too slow. The precision rifle guys may favor a 1:11 or 1:11.25, because that seems to be a fad among that crowd. But to my eye the 1:10 seems to fit my own uses best.

    Fluting. While it matters less with a shorter barrel than a longer one, there is still a lot of weight to be saved this way. I don't want a pencil barrel, because the gun has to be capable of maintaining accuracy through longer strings of fire. I would consider a carbon fiber barrel, but (a) I've never seen a short one, (b) they are very expensive, and (c) I haven't found any trustworthy evidence about how they fare under long strings of fire.

    .308 or 6.5CM. There aren't many good rifle cartridge options for a sub-16" barrel. I think .308 wins by a handy margin when going short, but the 6.5CM is still a contender in this role. I'd be interested to see what a 14.5" 6.5CM can do. I think you might still be able to wring out a 1000y shot with that gun, though I am not confident of that. I predict the same barrel length in a .308 is probably going to unwind around 700y. There are good arguments in favor of both cartridges, so why not give people options?

    MLOK foreend with a full Pic rail on top. I feel like I don't need to explain this one.

    BCG. C158, not 9310. I've put a lot of rounds through a 9310 bolt with no ill effects, but I have been persuaded that C158 is in fact a better steel and less prone to crack. Sticking with C158 may mean not having the slickest NP3 or nickel boron finish, but a little extra time spent cleaning the BCG is worth it in order to have the peace of mind.

    Skip the stock entirely and slap an A2 grip on there. Everybody has their own preference. People can just put their condiments on their own burger. If they buy the stock from you, then give them an option to have you put it on. But I seriously don't know anyone who is so incapable that they can't slip a Magpul stock onto a receiver extension. (I suppose the UBR is the odd exception, since the A5 tube is incorporated into the stock. So maybe offer the option of either a UBR or a plain A5 tube.)

    Finishing details. This is beyond the gun itself, but I envision adding a significant piece of glass to the top of mine. I've got a MK6 3-18x on a bolt gun that really doesn't need that much low end. I'll probably swap a 6.5-20x onto the bolt gun and move the 3-18x over to the Shorty AR10, then add an RMR to an offset mount. I was initially dismissive of the 45-degree mounts, but there are places where one is appropriate, and I think this gun might be one of those.
    Virtute et Armis

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Manistee MI
    Posts
    1,415
    I built something along these lines a couple of years back.

    I used an aero receiver set. I used a faxon gunner profile 16" barrel. I used a mft minimalist stock and a lightweight mlok rail to keep the weight down.

    If I remember correctly it came in around 7.8lbs without an optic.

    It was nice to carry, but a 308 in that light of a package jumped around a lot when shooting.

    An adjustable gas block was also needed for shooting suppressed. It seemed like there was a much larger variation in gas with different ammo then a 556, and adding a suppressor complicated it more

    Soli Deo Gloria
    Abortion is sacrificing your child on the alter of convenience....Adrian Rogers
    Soli Deo Gloria

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