The AK as a CDR (Civilian Defense Rifle)

[Gabe Suarez]

The AK as a CDR (Civilian Defense Rifle)

Another can of worms no doubt.

Excluding areas where one must use a "sporting rifle" what do you folks think about t6he AK as a primary "Go To" rifle?

I must admit I was leaning toward the AR series for various reasons - The availability of magazines, the theoretical resupply from the authorities, and availability of ammo, and spare parts.

I am rethinking my position on this. For a number of reasons.

1). AK magazines are very "available". In fact, much more so than AR mags. I just bought ten more through CDNN. Used magazines for the AK-47 for $7.00! Even used AR mags top ten bucks and they are so beat up you'd never rely on them. AK magazines are very tough. Want to go bankrupt? Start a business repairing AK mags.

2). As far as resupply from authorities. Well....I think Katrina had lessons for everyone about whether the authorities are your friends. They may be in some areas, but don't bet your survival on getting ammo, magazines, or anything from them.

3). Ammo. Well, that is still an issue, but knowing that you will not resupply from friendlies, it becomes a moot point. Stock up with as much as you can carry and keep your magazines loaded. That is another cool thing about AK magazines. They are cheap, strong and a great way to store ammo.

4). Spare parts. For an AR spare parts are important. For an AK? Next point.

5). Evil profile. Again, I default to Katrina. A private citizen with ANY WEAPON will be suspect, and probably targeted. AK or AR is not an issue here. What is is the ability to hide a folding stock AK much easier than a collapsed stock AR. The citizens' tactic will likely be "shoot and scoot".

What Say You??

[CPerez]

I do agree with all of your points, but we are focosing on the extreme level and not looking in the between, PR gets hit a lot by storms and hurracains, not to the level of Katrina in almost a 100 years thank God but in those cases hit very hard a colapsible stock rifle would have been great but I would change the apperance of the AK a bit, it might gain me a second or two, like chanching from 30rnd magazines to 20rnd Hungarian Magazines and puting a front stock like the one in the verp to breakout its apperance at a distance, here the AK is the prefered weapon of the "Sicario" the thugh the murderer and even the guys at the gun store fraun upon them, every one knows what the AK is but if a break the shape, put a German cap that says Polize it might make a responding oficer think for a second extra, especialy if he can't ID my rifle as an AK, this is in the case that thingh haven't gone compleatly FUBAR but if they do I belive the outline will of no issue since it will be survival of the fittest and better armed. Just my humble opinion

[Steve Holden]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Pasqua is Easter in Italian. Domenica is Sunday. These holidays are celebrated in East Africa. The Ethiopian Easter is a little latter. We concentrate on one at a time.

The AK will shoot and kill while the Armalite copies are being cleaned so they can fire.

Steve

[Gabe Suarez]

Steve,

Good point. The more I shoot my AK, the more my AR gathers dust. The AK is the Glock of rifles.

On Civilian use, this would only be an issue when order has collapsed. Thus the rule of thumb is, "If 911 ain't working, the rifle should be close at hand".

[Steve Holden]

Hi Gabe,

Some egg-spurts say that the AK is no good because it only does about 4-6" at 100 yards.

I will take that as long as I get to do it first.

Steve

[Gabe Suarez]

That is what we call "Minute Of Man"

[Kelvin Rincon-Galue]

I agreed with Steve, the AR are high maintenance, where as the AK is almost maintenance free, almost indestructable, reliable and accurate enough! As a matter of fact most wars (before Iraqui Freedom) were faught at 300yards apprx. which the AK max. range is 400 yards. the AK is 550 mt. and lets face it we will not face an adversary that far even in the new era of war we are fighting within the 150mt if not less. AK has a whole lot more power than the AR at close and far distances, it is more compact than the AR. Has more peircing power than the AR. very economic. From the military perspective In Iraq, if you face a bad day in a street fight and you are outnumbered (that only happens if you are in the ARMY ) and you are running low in ammo you are SOL because the enemy has 7.62X39mm instead of 5.56X45mm, I rather have an AK!
About the perception of an AK I think it is sad that people would look at an AK and think Terrorist and AR an LE, a man with a gun is a man with a gun regardless, besides even Force Recon and Navy Seals member carry an AK (at least one of them for all the advantages mention in this thread)
here are my 2 cents

[Kelvin Rincon-Galue]

4-6" at 100 yards? that is god for me! good MOM like Gabe said!

[jack76590]

I just bought a Bushmaster M4. Got jams in first hundred rounds. Not a double feed but something similar. Brass does not eject and goes high in receiver, then fresh round gets feed part way and jam. Seems the short barrels cause the extractor to let go too fast. Bushmaster send me their version of D-fender which is rubber washer to increase extractor pressure along with new extractor spring and insert. While installing new extractor spring and insert it went flying and I only found spring. So used old insert with new spring and Bushmaster rubber washer. Will see if works, but I hate this having to tweek rifle and small parts that go flying.

Now my SAR1 with cocked parts and stock with really bad stain job seems to go bang, bang without much problem.

If selection came down to parts availablity vs how often parts required, I think I would select gun which did not often require parts even if parts not as available.

I believe that while a folding stock is a specialized item, that it would be a good thing in Katina type situation. In that situation you might want the ability to move around in front of authorities and not have your rifle showing. I may install folding stock on my SAR1 for this specialized purpose. It will then fit into the bottom of my LL Bean rolling duffle. Not much says solidly middle class than LL Bean.

[smince]

Originally Posted by Kelvin Rincon-Galue

About the perception of an AK I think it is sad that people would look at an AK and think Terrorist and AR an LE, a man with a gun is a man with a gun regardless,

I've been reading a lot lately about the "profile" of an AK signaling someone as a terrorist. I agree with you, it is sad. I've noticed though, with only a realtively small investment, the profile can be changed. Add a collapsing or folding stock, add a Galil-type or rail handguard, different pistol grip. Nothing wrong with the way it is. But if the profile bothers someone, it is an easy fix.

Another step is to use 20 round, instead of 30 round mags. Add some of or all the above, stick in a 20-rounder, and it doesn't "look" like an AK anymore(at least not to a casual observer).

Question, though: Are the 20-round AK mags as reliable as the 30's? I've always preferred the compact mags in most of my weapons, but have no experience with the short AK mags.