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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    302
    Thanks for all the suggestions so far. I don't feel scared, small or unarmed when I don't have my gun, I usually have a fairly nice pocket knife that looks less like a weapon than it actually is and just hold it up next to my cellphone as I walk in, no one has ever said anything about it. I'm partially thinking this could be good practice, but clearly the physical scanner may matter less and the people more, so it's educational but not foolproof as practice.

    I actually wonder if one of the things yall mentioned earlier didn't happen to me. We hadn't been in the park a half hour, and we got there early so they were not crowded, when an armed guard posted up and watched me waiting for my kids on a water ride. He stood and looked at me for a solid 10 minutes before wandering off. Maybe my ankle kit got flagged and he was following up? Never saw any other specific attention to myself or others.

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    Blessed be the Lord my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight. Psalms, 144:1

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    651
    I recently tested a similar system in a similar situation. Detectors made a pistol a hard no, and even knives were essentially not allowed. I found a spot to put the knife anyway that was completely hidden but not in a “hidden spot”. It would be impossible to see it via visible light camera. The system immediately put a red box on the location of the knife but the second layer of misdirection worked just fine. Folding pocket knife with G10 handles so very small amount of metal. I didn’t get a chance to witness myself on screen but they didn’t stop me although I had a small flashlight, belt buckle, and keys.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    1,847
    Quote Originally Posted by Redbug View Post
    I wonder...Can the camera in use with the detector be able to see a polymer type fixed blade knife? Can the AI software pick them up, too?
    I'm not in that industry but being in software I can tell you that that technology is most likely using a combination of gait analysis and image processing. So regardless of the composition of the knife or gun it could be detected. The idea with image processing, and keep in mind that I've only done enough of it to understand the concepts during college, is that you feed an application a wide variety of images of the same type of thing, in this case a concealed firearm, and with each image it establishes a sort of pattern or baseline of metrics from each image. Combine enough of them and you eventually get a distilled pattern of what the object in question looks like. If memory serves this is called a heuristic.

    The heuristic can then be used as a sort of a measuring stick against other images to predict whether or not the new image is close enough to the others to be statistically likely to be the same thing. That's where a little bit of statistical analysis is thrown in with it as well. I believe what is sold as AI detection really isn't ai, it's just this sort of image processing that I described.

    A simple example of that is present in Amazon photos. If you store all of your family photos there like I do, and type into the search bar "license," it would pull up any photos that look close enough to a license using a heuristic. I get pictures of my driver's license, some documents, and other photo IDs that may be stored there.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    281
    Has anyone had experience with a g10 blade designed for stabbing ?

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    NW Washington
    Posts
    2,711
    Quote Originally Posted by apamburn View Post

    A simple example of that is present in Amazon photos. If you store all of your family photos there like I do, and type into the search bar "license," it would pull up any photos that look close enough to a license using a heuristic. I get pictures of my driver's license, some documents, and other photo IDs that may be stored there.
    You store photos of sensitive information like personal ID cards on Amazon?

    Seems like a glaring example of people trading away their privacy and security for a little bit of convenience.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    1,847
    Quote Originally Posted by Yondering View Post
    You store photos of sensitive information like personal ID cards on Amazon?

    Seems like a glaring example of people trading away their privacy and security for a little bit of convenience.
    Well, as far as security goes, I trust Amazon data centers and infosec more than I trust most companies with my data.

    Almost all online companies monetize your data, so that's not exactly shocking here either.

    I'm not exactly sure if the surprise is directed at trusting Amazon with the data - I don't even bat an eye at that.

    Or if the surprise is because you're worried about the source being compromised? That would either require a very serious leak at Amazon (possible but I consider it highly improbable) or someone figuring out my 128 bit randomized password, or resetting that password (requiring them to have compromised my 128 bit email acct password and also defeating Amazon's 2 factor authentication). In other words, very improbable.

    From that perspective storing data on Amazon is infinitely more secure than storing on my own internet-connected server (which I would need to maintain with security updates, property networking security, etc).

    It is a trade off - one I, a senior software engineer in the software security space, am willing to make.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    NW Washington
    Posts
    2,711
    Quote Originally Posted by apamburn View Post
    Well, as far as security goes, I trust Amazon data centers and infosec more than I trust most companies with my data.

    Almost all online companies monetize your data, so that's not exactly shocking here either.

    I'm not exactly sure if the surprise is directed at trusting Amazon with the data - I don't even bat an eye at that.

    Or if the surprise is because you're worried about the source being compromised? That would either require a very serious leak at Amazon (possible but I consider it highly improbable) or someone figuring out my 128 bit randomized password, or resetting that password (requiring them to have compromised my 128 bit email acct password and also defeating Amazon's 2 factor authentication). In other words, very improbable.

    From that perspective storing data on Amazon is infinitely more secure than storing on my own internet-connected server (which I would need to maintain with security updates, property networking security, etc).

    It is a trade off - one I, a senior software engineer in the software security space, am willing to make.
    Credit card databases get hacked all the time, and I'm sure those are significantly more secure than whatever Amazon "promises" to do with your data. As for trusting Amazon - lol, I'd trust them about as far as I trust Google.

    Maybe I'm old-school, but my files belong to me. They don't need to be stored on a server anywhere, and certainly not by some other entity. They reside in my own storage, that I control on my own property.
    I'm not a software engineer, but I'm a test engineer - I look for when and how things go wrong, and how to prevent it from happening again once they do. That "secure storage" thing has gone wrong before, and I'm certain it will again; my solution is to not give other people my info unless I have to.
    Last edited by Yondering; 11-04-2022 at 05:20 PM.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    1,847
    Quote Originally Posted by Yondering View Post
    Credit card databases get hacked all the time, and I'm sure those are significantly more secure than whatever Amazon "promises" to do with your data. As for trusting Amazon - lol, I'd trust them about as far as I trust Google.

    Maybe I'm old-school, but my files belong to me. They don't need to be stored on a server anywhere, and certainly not by some other entity. They reside in my own storage, that I control on my own property.
    I'm not a software engineer, but I'm a test engineer - I look for when and how things go wrong, and how to prevent it from happening again once they do. That "secure storage" thing has gone wrong before, and I'm certain it will again; my solution is to not give other people my info unless I have to.
    Yep it's totally reasonable approach to take, but the convenience is worth it to me. For whatever it's worth I don't typically store licenses and so forth in Amazon photos although occasionally I'll use it as a middleman if I need to get something uploaded and accessibility to my computer for a loan application or something of the like.

    I started my career as a software engineer in QA/test working on automation and on the one hand I see where you're coming from. On the other, I don't have a dedicated team of a couple of dozen QA engineers constantly testing my home server and I also don't have dedicated pen testers trying to break through my firewall and server configuration, while Amazon does and furthermore has legal obligation to do so.

    If I were to store all of my data exclusively on my own devices I would want them accessible anywhere much like Amazon photos and while I would have a much smaller Target on my back than Amazon or Google I also have a much smaller capacity to implement effective security protocols. And so the calculus for me lies on outsourcing those duties to an entity that specializes in them for my own convenience.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    SWFL
    Posts
    703
    If you look into my posts I have some experience on the matter. However, last week due to increased Security due to a Special event, and I didn't want to cause any issues because of that, I went in with an empty coin sap, pocket full of coins, and a G10 punch dagger. OC was in my companions bra. In hindsight, I probably could've gotten what I wanted through, like before.
    KRG-1: Kalashnikov Rifle Gunfighting
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    TWOTU since 2016

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Where the deer and antelope roam
    Posts
    1,147
    My retirement gig is security at a federal court. Our magnetometers will pick up a paperclip in your pocket. Levi's set them off as well. Any alarms are identified. All carried items and pocket contents are X-rayed. Of course we are not lazy and are well trained.

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