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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    5,244

    Default Help brainstorming a woman's defense

    There's this woman. She's a degreed and professionally licensed type dealing with mental health. Just switched to a new job with the .gov working with a new to her client base. She's fit, strong for a woman, and physically active. At least on the square range, she's a superior shot. I know, because she's been in my class.

    So, she comes to me, having discovered that some of her new clients might be problematic. As in a non-zero chance that they could shoot up the place. To be fair, it's a really, really small percentage: we're not talking "reformed" bangers on supervised release. There's also a larger, but still really (only one "really" here) small chance for unarmed assault from one of them. After all, we are talking mental health.

    There's a higher risk that she'd be caught by her employer with a gun than that she'd need it. Pretty much instant termination that would leave her unemployable in her field.

    OC is already on hand. Juggled some stuff so it could live on her instead of in her purse. I recommended a CRKT Bear Claw for a "get the fuck off of me" knife (concealment from the employer still being part of the issue).

    Me being me, I would still like to figure out a pistol. Working with her clothing is a non-negotiable must. Slacks and a blouse, suit jacket in winter: professional, but Arizona professional. She's already wearing flat shoes she can run in, so there's that.

    What have you got for me, what am I missing?
    __________

    "To spit on your hands and lower the pike; to stand fast over the body of Leonidas the King; to be rear guard at Kunu-Ri; to stand and be still to the Birkenhead Drill; these are not rational acts. They are often merely necessary." Pournelle

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western WA
    Posts
    5,183
    Glock 43x, ideally with a comp. Or a comped 43 if the 43x is too big to conceal the grip in her clothing.

    Belt and trigger guard holster. And lots of practice just wearing it. Walking around, using the rest room, etc. I know a good many people who carry even though it would mean termination. Somehow they manage it.

    But yes, I know belts can be problematic for women’s clothing. And women’s clothing is more difficult for concealment in general, at least for those that don’t want to look like annie oakley. At the same time, women have way more leeway in their fashion choices than men.

    Daily concealed carry in a work NPE is a skill, and a discipline, all its own.
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

  3. #3
    Cut the bottom half or two thirds off one of the pocket liners and put a Seecamp or Derringer of some sort in a garter band near the "hot zone"?
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    Last edited by Fat; 06-24-2022 at 07:11 PM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    420
    www.flashbangstore.com

    NPE possibilites.
    NRA Pistol Instructor
    HITS - 3, 8/12/16
    CRG - 3, 8/13 - 8/14/16
    RGF - 2, 7/15 - 7/16/17
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    Kalashnikov Rifle Gunfighting, 10/12 - 10/13/19
    Advanced Kalashnikov Gunfighting 10/11 - 10/12/20
    TN/GA/AL Training Group

    "40 shots rang out....40 people fell. Patti and the Killer missed each other, but they shot that town to Hell!"
    Cow Patti, Jim Stafford via Randy Harris

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    15,830
    Quote Originally Posted by Sharkbite View Post
    www.flashbangstore.com

    NPE possibilites.
    The Ole Heifer carries a Glock 42 (380) in one. She started with a Ruger LCP them moved up. Would like to get a Model 43 (9mm) when money is available. She likes it.
    I rather you hated me for who I am than love me for who I ain't!
    This Ain't the Movies, and You Ain't John Wayne!

    Sometimes it is entirely appropriate to kill a fly with a 12 pound sledgehammer!
    TRAIN HARD= SOONER OR LATER YOU"LL NEED IT!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    15,830
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragsbo View Post
    The Ole Heifer carries a Glock 42 (380) in one. She started with a Ruger LCP them moved up. Would like to get a Model 43 (9mm) when money is available. She likes it.
    Want to add, you do have to "dress around" it. Some tops are too tight, and dresses might require you lift your skirt to your armpits to get at gun. ALSO it helps to be well endowed (as the ole heifer is) to help make the space for it
    I rather you hated me for who I am than love me for who I ain't!
    This Ain't the Movies, and You Ain't John Wayne!

    Sometimes it is entirely appropriate to kill a fly with a 12 pound sledgehammer!
    TRAIN HARD= SOONER OR LATER YOU"LL NEED IT!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Lower Golden State
    Posts
    209
    You've only mentioned .gov...is that city, county, state or federal? Law Dog minimizes the prosecuting of such discoveries, but it seems to vary with who she's really working for. .Fed seemingly more 'vindictive'. Any bare-handed/chemical stuff needs continual practice...and still may incur consequences. especially if the offender survives and gets lawyered up. My better half embraced the training and woman-specific gear but does not work in an environment where she could be scanned, searched of outed by a fool office 'karen'. That pretty much negates the stashing concept. 'Prolly best to pin down HR, diplomatically, so as not to paint herself with a red flag. Prayers sent for her finding the right balance and personal safety. How did they do it during the covid?...Zoom Meetings!
    DVC...and distance from disorder

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    483
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Spade View Post
    There's this woman. She's a degreed and professionally licensed type dealing with mental health. Just switched to a new job with the .gov working with a new to her client base. She's fit, strong for a woman, and physically active. At least on the square range, she's a superior shot. I know, because she's been in my class.

    So, she comes to me, having discovered that some of her new clients might be problematic. As in a non-zero chance that they could shoot up the place. To be fair, it's a really, really small percentage: we're not talking "reformed" bangers on supervised release. There's also a larger, but still really (only one "really" here) small chance for unarmed assault from one of them. After all, we are talking mental health.

    There's a higher risk that she'd be caught by her employer with a gun than that she'd need it. Pretty much instant termination that would leave her unemployable in her field.

    OC is already on hand. Juggled some stuff so it could live on her instead of in her purse. I recommended a CRKT Bear Claw for a "get the fuck off of me" knife (concealment from the employer still being part of the issue).

    Me being me, I would still like to figure out a pistol. Working with her clothing is a non-negotiable must. Slacks and a blouse, suit jacket in winter: professional, but Arizona professional. She's already wearing flat shoes she can run in, so there's that.

    What have you got for me, what am I missing?
    I would always encourage employees to follow the rules of their employer, especially the Government.

    As a general comment, if one were to take a firearm in to their office and just leave it there, one would only need to carry it in once. There would be several methods to secure the gun from prying eyes and sticky fingers when out of the office.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Phoenix, Arizona
    Posts
    7,764
    Badger and Brent are both on the money. For Brent's comment about belts just use an industrial strength safety pin like those found with military cravats on the inside of the wasteband to secure the lanyard of the NPE holster. As for Badger, if it is only the occasional client that is troublesome one left in a secureable, accessible location is a solution.

    For training, practice clearing distance and accessing the firearm. Forearm shivers and elbow strikes are simple, repeatable, powerful, and unlikely to injure her with delivery but that's more in Brent's wheelhouse than mine.
    Greg "Hyena" Nichols
    Instagram: tacfit_az
    Facebook: SI Instructor Greg Nichols

    #thinkinginviolence
    #tactisexual

    Always entertaining, mildly offensive
    IANative: Indeed, when you grab Brent (or he grabs you), it feels like liquid unobtanium wrapped in rawhide... whereas Greg is just solid muscle wrapped in hate, seasoned w/ snuff and a little lead.

    http://www.warriortalk.com/showthrea...he-Obscenities

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western WA
    Posts
    5,183
    I'm not a big fan of stashing stuff in a work place where one doesn't have 100% control over your desk, locker, office, etc. Even if you have an office with a key, management/janitorial staff still have access. All it takes is one nosey co-worker or janitor looking in the wrong spot at the wrong time and you're looking for a new job. Not to mention when something goes in a drawer or hiding spot, it can often be forgotten until particularly inconvenient circumstances.

    Luck plays into this a lot. In many years of working in many places, to my knowledge I've never had someone look through my desk, locker, etc. But I don't KNOW that it's never happened. Were I to stash something it damn well would be difficult to find, but bad luck happens.

    Personal security and ability to project force is important...we discuss that stuff every day! But keeping an income is also part of our security plan and quality of life. These have to be balanced. I am NOT saying don't be armed, but am saying that the office environment poses unique challenges.

    Stashing an item has it's place but in my mind that is more about proactive, nefarious purpose rather than every day defense in an office.



    If self-preservation is something that's important to us, we find a way to keep the right tools on our body.

    One thing I use a lot is "lap top carry". This is different from purse carry, even though it may seem the same, and it's easy to accomplish in many places. It is NOT the same thing as carrying on the body and is utterly useless for most personal protection scenarios. It's only a viable thing for things that are pretty unlikely...but, it's potentially a lot of firepower right next to your feet under the desk. Use the imagination.
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

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