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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Beyond The Wall
    Posts
    49,554
    Quote Originally Posted by steve_k View Post
    "Beware the man with only one gun, for he knows how to use it well"
    That is simply a sign of poverty or of a lack of interest...not of skill, ability, or anything else.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa View Post
    1. Who cares if he has to sneak out to buy ammo? Long as he does.
    2. He did call.
    3. He did shoot.
    4. He asked questions.

    Unaccustomed as I am to optimism, the glass is 10% full. Well, maybe 5%.

    Don't be busy.
    Glimmer of hope here. Does he watch YT or Vimeo? Might be an avenue to provide wisdom through those avenue....

    Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    49
    You haven't failed your uncle yet. It sounds like he just needs some patience.

    There is a huge difference between people that don't know what they don't know and people that don't *want* to know what they don't know. This sounds like the first situation. That's easily fixable. I would take his interest in going with you to the range as a very positive sign.

    The easiest way to show people what they don't know is to demonstrate a skills gap. This works with physical skills as well as academic subjects. In this case, set up two targets at 3 to 5 yards. Using his pistol and his ammo shoot a three round group. Then have him shoot a three round group on his target. The difference between these groups will be 100% explained and demonstrated by his lack of skill. It will remove any excuses such as "I know what I'm doing but I only have a cheap gun" or "I'm using bad ammo' etc... When I taught a CCW class, I did this in every class with every student. It shows them what their equipment is capable of contrasted to their current skill level. Removing excuses before they form is very helpful.

    You can also do a ball and dummy drill right then and there to show him part of why he's not shooting well. Of course sight alignment, sight picture etc... need to be correct, but trigger pull is easily demonstrable.

    After that, you can explain some simple dryfire drills to him. One of my favorites is putting a coin on the front or back sights and pulling the trigger without the coin falling off the sights. Demonstrate the drill to show him that it can be done, then have him perform a few repetitions.

    This should get through to him.
    KWTL Feb 2022

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Lower Golden State
    Posts
    211
    Great suggestions here...and thank you for Not Giving Up! Uncle is reaching out to you, and I bet every headline & news item makes him want to 'shoot like you'. Just may not be able to express that, might not even recognize it. If it was just you and him against the crowd, well...
    DVC

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    NW Washington
    Posts
    3,320
    Quote Originally Posted by krav51 View Post
    The phrase "not everyone deserves my training" appears applicable here.
    Absolutely. And it can be a really hard lesson to learn, and to remember. Sometimes especially when we're able to offer the teaching free of charge; it can be hard to remember that some people just won't listen and aren't worth the effort of opening your mouth.

    Not saying that's the case with the OP, just a general observation of my own experience.


    A while back my little sister and her new husband asked me to teach them the basics of shooting a pistol, and at least they listened to my input and bought a G19. My sister (Brent has met her, and I think got the same impression) is one of those people who are a sponge for training, very teachable. I showed her some basics and pretty soon had her drilling a palm sized group at 10 yards. Cool.
    Brother in law is a genuinely nice guy, but as a guy, of course he "already knows everything" at the core of his psyche. He was right there and got the same training as my sister, but said he's shot before. Proceeds to shotgun ammo all over the backstop and into the ground, hitting the target once or twice. Probably feeling bad that his new wife who's never shot before just showed him up, he says he's got it down and ready to leave. Never have shot with him again, despite numerous offers.

    Some people just don't want to learn. Guys often much worse than girls. I think it's tied deeply to their personal image, that somehow needing to learn a skill makes them less than the person training them, and obviously that's not true so there's nothing to learn here. Or something along those lines; I'm not a psychologist, I just observe people.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Third Coast
    Posts
    4,818
    Quote Originally Posted by Warped Mindless View Post
    Uncle calls me up today asking if I want to go shooting. Told me he snuck over to the gun store and bought another box of 50. Why did he have to “sneak” over? Because apparently his wife won’t let him buy ammo saying it’s a waste of money. Honestly, if he’s shooting it, it probably is a waste.

    I planned on shooting anyways so I tell him he’s welcome to come out.

    He shows up, pulls his Bersa out of his pocket, racks the slide and rapid fired 8 rounds into the IDPA target at 5yds. No improvement over last time.

    I notice at that point he starts watching me fire my sig 365xl into a target at 10 yards and getting a nice little group.

    “How do you do that?” He ask.

    “Lots of practice.” I reply mostly ignoring him.

    “Wife won’t let me buy that much ammo.” He looks sad as he says this.

    “Dry fire is free and to be honest I don’t shoot many live rounds anymore. Almost all my practice is done with dry fire.” I tell him while loading some mags.

    He looks at me, as with absolute conviction and authority, sates “that dry fire stuff don’t work. You have to shoot the gun for real.”

    ”Tell that to my target.” I said.

    We changed subjects and he quickly fired through all of his ammo and left. I learned that he’s now carrying his gun in his pocket without a holster but without one in the chamber.

    I suspect that next time he ask to go shooting with me that I’ll be “busy.” Probably be busy every time after that too.
    he flipped houses and cars.

    Next time, tell him you going to do a flip on this great opportunity you found (pick a shitty house, in a shitty neighborhood, add 200% to asking price) and how great youre going to do. Hell you may decide not to sell it but rent it instead........

    After the vein in his head stops bulging, let him explain to you why its a bad idea, be receptive ask pertinent questions, and take his advice in the end...... then flip the script and explain he is the SME in his field, but you are the SME in this one. Ask him if he is gonna filp that overpriced house in the hood.

    sometimes it takes an example to make the lightbulb go off.
    NEVER CONFUSE GETTING LUCKY WITH GOOD TACTICS (unless you are at the bar)

    I'm not in the business of Losing

    A stab to the taint beats most of the mystical bullshit, most of the time

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    east coast
    Posts
    541
    Your "uncle". There is family, and there are relatives. Perhaps he is merely a relative you should not concern yourself with? I can count family on one hand only.

  8. #28
    A few probably disorganized thoughts...

    *) An Airsoft PP or PPK maybe might be a "good enough" surrogate for casual basement/garage practice.

    *) Maybe one of those laser cartridge thingies? Honestly, I usually kind of view them as a crutch, but in this case if it gets him pulling the trigger...

    *) Any chance of being able to get a second heater? Any halfway decent .22 target autoloader is going to be a lot better practice tool than the Bersa.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Noladishu, Karjakistan (aka New Orleans, LA)
    Posts
    1,532
    Maybe he’s one of those guys who’s really competent in some areas so much so they fear failing/sucking in other areas. Maybe it’s one of those “it’s not important because I’m not good at it.”

    You’d know better than me. A trip is a trip. As long as it’s not costing ya anything, no harm keeping his interest going.
    "Mindset without skill is simply empty defiance, and skill without mindset is mere martial posturing." -GS

    RP 1085

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