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  1. #141
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    If I had to go get someone and was lucky enough to get a hold of Mr. Anthony and/or Hasher and have them in the window I need I would still want to hide gear to the greatest extent possible. Rigs under coats, rifles or whatever tucked up under the arm or coat too. That way we had the highest posibility to get as far as we could without alarming people and causing complications. Running in with a visible rig and rifle at low ready presents other issues. A lot of it would also depend how far down the rabbit hole things are and what the goal is.

    If the goal was a direct action against a commie rat hole things would be a little different. Then having your cock out from the get go would be a benifit.
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  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorkface View Post
    If I had to go get someone and was lucky enough to get a hold of Mr. Anthony and/or Hasher and have them in the window I need I would still want to hide gear to the greatest extent possible. Rigs under coats, rifles or whatever tucked up under the arm or coat too. That way we had the highest posibility to get as far as we could without alarming people and causing complications. Running in with a visible rig and rifle at low ready presents other issues. A lot of it would also depend how far down the rabbit hole things are and what the goal is.

    If the goal was a direct action against a commie rat hole things would be a little different. Then having your cock out from the get go would be a benifit.
    The moral of the story: Make some similarly martially-inclined friends in my AO.

    And make my upper body a lot bigger (working on that part).

  3. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorkface View Post
    Indeed. There seems to be a couple of diverging paths. One where someone is fortunate enough to have a team of people to work with towards a goal and the reality that a lot of us will be largely on our own or could have a second. It could be representative of early stages of... whatever comes... and some point past that where groups gather by circumstance or by pre planned actions.

    If a group of a half dozen or ten people with an SUV or two and a mission burn rubber to accomplish something with the goal of getting in and out quickly they have the ability to project a lot of ill intent and back it up. A nimble load out only makes sense as no one would want to doddle or over tax themselves in case heat up. A person or two wouldn't likely be able to do the same. Though it would depend on how many bad guys were around. Pulling up in the middle of a commie riot with a couple hundred people would be hard for one or two people to respond too using the same tactics and hit the front door in a hi vis way. Parking the car a street over in the alley while going up and in through fire escape trying to draw as little attention as they can would likely be a better move. Managing and mitigating variables can be interesting.
    Here is how I see this shaking out:

    The first guy to have to do something like this is going to be alone. He may succeed; he may not. But he’ll shed a lot of commie blood on his sword before he goes down. After that, it will become acceptable for otherwise “reasonable” men to call their friends and ask for someone to ride shotgun (or AR) with them when they have to do a rescue run.

    But until someone normalizes the behavior, most of us will face this alone.

    This makes me want to live closer to my brother.
    Virtute et Armis

  4. #144
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    Feb 2008
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    Lightbulb Suppressor considerations

    Quote Originally Posted by tat2steve View Post
    Suppressor ? Maybe not needed, make a bunch of noise, people running and screaming could be to your advantage, a smoke grenade could aid in the confussion.
    What I have seen since 2020 is gunfire actually attracts the zombies. Rittenhouse killed a guy and they kept coming, they did not seem to understand that attacking a guy with a gun that has already shot someone was a bad idea. He had to shoot two more before the commies clued in that this was not Call of Duty but real life. The rules have changed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Yamamoto View Post
    Suppressor - maybe, maybe not. Depends on details. What are you trying to accomplish?

    And it's not like they are Hollywood quiet anyway. But it's certainly a lot more pleasant on the ears.

    Personally if I know I'm going into something, I want the option.
    Having the option is my thinking as well. I am not trying to hijack this thread with suppressor talk, I think it is relevant to increasing odds of success in this scenario so I'll throw it out there. Some 9mm suppressors get down into the <120db range, but only under certain conditions. Any suppressor carried into something like this will be lucky to keep <140db. So not Hollywood but remember every 3db is doubling the sound energy and this scenario will already be noisy so Hollywood is not necessary. You are probably not going out into the still of night breaking into a place with armed guards with nothing else to do so mouse fart quiet isn't necessary. High 150's to low 160's dbs (normal range) down to <140dbs is another world and changes the game. Reducing how far sound will carry can make or break your mission. Indoors it can make or break your ears. Even with earpro you still have bone conduction so even then it is still relevant.

    If you bring a pistol can you may want a K sized suppressor for your pistol, that is ~5in long max. Holstering a suppressed pistol, even a K, is extremely problematic and I am exploring this now and there are no great options, but a couple acceptable ones given the tremendous logistical issues to overcome. I will find out this year how feasible this is, or not. You cannot quick detach a pistol can due to the boosters pistols require so some logistics to sort out.

    Rifle caliber suppressors make even your handy little SBR a heavy barreled regular length rifle. Fortunately there are lots of QD options for rifles so you can stow it in a small pouch and have it on in about 3 seconds. 5.56 is very hard to suppress and, in my opinion at this point, there is only one company that produces a good dedicated 5.56 suppressor that won't gas you out and cause malfunctions. 300BLK is a little easier and you can use a shorter barrel, but energy-wise a subsonic 300BLK is like a subsonic 40SW or a hot 45, depending on your cartridge. 300BLK supers can be very AK-like but the right cartridge choice is critical. So one could carry one mag of 300BLK subs and have a vastly reduced sound signature option and skip the pistol can. If you are solo this might be the best option. I am almost there with this setup.

    Either way, a lightweight high performance rifle caliber can is going to cost you as much as your tier 1 rifle. I have one of the best 30 cal cans available in jail right now and it was financially painful but it will be very versatile, doing a great job with 300BLK and able to do better than average with 5.56. By the middle of this year I will have this and several pistol cans in hand and will be testing them out.

    If you have a team, one guy with a PCC with subs and a high performing can might be an option. That guy could take point while things are quiet, picking off anyone that gets in the way without alerting all zombies in a 1KM radius. Then if all hell breaks loose, that guy falls back and becomes the tail gunner. I have a PCC that will have ~10" total barrel length with the can, and total length of ~25" that can be shortened further with the folding stock and hopefully <130dbs with subs. That can increase your odds of getting into wherever you want to go and grabbing your objective, which increases the odds of getting out.

    Suppression is a rabbit hole but I will stop here. Hopefully this adds to the discussion.
    Last edited by ex-racer; 01-14-2022 at 06:20 PM.

  5. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by LawDog View Post
    Here is how I see this shaking out:

    The first guy to have to do something like this is going to be alone. He may succeed; he may not. But he’ll shed a lot of commie blood on his sword before he goes down. After that, it will become acceptable for otherwise “reasonable” men to call their friends and ask for someone to ride shotgun (or AR) with them when they have to do a rescue run.

    But until someone normalizes the behavior, most of us will face this alone.

    This makes me want to live closer to my brother.
    Maybe. The art of the rifle...the combat rifle not the sporting rifle, includes a team component. There is nothing defensive about rifle use so their deployment in a team context is a good expression of proactive.

    Now...January 2022 we havent arrived at the point yet...where we have created local militias to handle events outside the purview of local LE. The AZ rangers are an interesting group but physically unimpressive.

    Begin house to house vax checks...more riots...things like that and I expect more will change as a countermeasure.

    Now all of that said...I will bet driving up onto the side walk in your G Ride...plates preeemptively removed...and bailing out alone with a rifle and attired for battle...with a clear mission and objective...for which you will shoot those that might try to stop you...will likely yield success.

    Why?

    Because people are pussies. If you look and act like a soul snatching copy of the angel of death, they will leave you alone...specially when a few of their number lay dead or dying. And unlike Rittenhouse...you leave with your package. Trust me...I have seen it.

    Think outside the lines.
    Last edited by Gabriel Suarez; 01-14-2022 at 07:55 PM.
    Gabriel Suarez

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  6. #146
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    What is the go-to written reference on team tactics? I’ve trained on this some in classes, but there is always the ‘drinking from a firehouse’ issue in classes, and I lack training partners when I return home. A book that I could go back to repeatedly would help.
    Virtute et Armis

  7. #147
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    No book that I am aware of...our CQB Video is close...and tge Paladin Tactics Video. I think there was a thread here discussing SWAT V Gang Unit tactics. I think this is more Gang Unit stuff. There are a myriad of videos on YT by guys that always had great logistics. Thats not us.

    Corners...doors...hallways...division of responsibility...stuff like that. It really isnt difficult.
    Gabriel Suarez

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  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Suarez View Post
    No book that I am aware of...our CQB Video is close...and tge Paladin Tactics Video. I think there was a thread here discussing SWAT V Gang Unit tactics. I think this is more Gang Unit stuff. There are a myriad of videos on YT by guys that always had great logistics. Thats not us.

    Corners...doors...hallways...division of responsibility...stuff like that. It really isnt difficult.
    Nope. A structure is a structure. A corner is a corner, a wall is a wall, a door is a door, a hallway is a hallway.

    Streets and alleys are just big hallways. Exterior corners are the same as interior. It all still applies. One thing not covered in CQB is danger crossings but that really isn't a thing with an individual and with a team there are a couple of different techniques but the idea is static security and moving the rest across the open space (like an intersection). 1 man posts at the corner, 2 man crosses and takes security the other direction, 3 man either crosses completely or replaces the 1 man, 1 man is either rolled up last or replaces the 2 man until the 3 man rolls up.

    Easy peasy

    ETA: common method is called Scroll the Road if you want to Google it.
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  9. #149
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    Funny...CQB is like chess. Life and death chess. Once you are used to looking at the world as corners, walls, and doors...lol.

    Identify danger areas. If you are alone you will work your ass off. Each man finds a job. Together they solve the problem.

    Learning concepts is easiest at its base level...indoors. then expand outward. And danger crossing is in context...the theory is the same.

    I wonder if anyone realizes the value of this stuff. And the fact that nobody else is teaching in this context.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

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  10. #150
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    What I have seen since 2020 is gunfire actually attracts the zombies. Rittenhouse killed a guy and they kept coming, they did not seem to understand that attacking a guy with a gun that has already shot someone was a bad idea. He had to shoot two more before the commies clued in that this was not Call of Duty but real life. The rules have changed. (Quote)

    Yes well not to take anything away from Kyle Rittenhouse, but the reason they kept coming is because Kyle was shooting in strictly a defensive fashion. If he was on his feet and proactively turned anyone’s head, who got within 10 feet of him, into a canoe, aggressively, I guarantee no one would be approaching him. In fact I’d be willing to bet they’d scatter like the cockroaches they are...

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