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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
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    I will add, it could be “coopers scout rifle with modern Suarez influence”.... Better, faster, and modernized....
    Nothing says Fuck You like a shotgun.....

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    1,890
    12” groups at 600 yds also assumes a perfect hold and range estimation.

    We should be striving for something around 1” @ 100 who CB given most folks shooting skills is probably 12-15” at 600.
    I carry two kinds of trauma kits. One for fixing it and one for causing it.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasher View Post
    12” groups at 600 yds also assumes a perfect hold and range estimation.

    We should be striving for something around 1” @ 100 who CB given most folks shooting skills is probably 12-15” at 600.
    I’m not sure with a light barrel you will get it consistently. I was just throwing that out there so people can understand accuracy and limitations.... I am building one for 1/2 Moa or better, that will be a lot heavier then this concept. There’s a fine line between what people actually do need and what it’s for. Most guys will probably get it and shoot 147g ball through them.... Why, because that is what people will buy because it’s cheaper or that’s what they already have.... Its not supposed to be a sniper, I would think it would be all with the potential to be in the Dmr role if you are capable with tested capable ammo...
    Nothing says Fuck You like a shotgun.....

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    2,409
    I know there's a lot of discussion about gas systems, buffers/buffer springs, etc. Even the adjustable gas blocks.

    I know what recoil is/feels like. I started out years ago shooting 03s, M1917s and M14's (Army). Then I got into M1 Garands (powder puff compared to the 03 and M1917, in my opinion).

    That comment I made about my GII having less felt recoil than my AR15 .300 BO is true. I put my nose on the charging handle just like my 5.56 AR15s and the .300 BO AR15. After a couple groups wtih the .300 BO, I don't really want to keep smacking my nose anymore.

    For what it's worth, When I put the A1 stock on mine I used an M16 buffer tube, M16/AR15 rifle buffer spring and M16/AR15 rifle buffer. The rifle buffer isn't the right length for the longer GII/.308 bolt. I did some measuring and then removed the buffer bumper pin, bumper and weights and shortened the buffer. Reinstalled the weights and the bumper and pin. Shoots/functions fine and the recoil isn't anything like the other .308s or .30-06s I own/shoot.

    Anyone got an idea of the effects of using a modified buffer with the standard 5.56 rifle spring?

    And I do have an adjustable gas block on it but no fine tuning, just 6 clicks out from closed and it works (worked at 5 and I went one more click for a cushion). Oh yeah, SA (Superlative Arms) gas block if that adds to the discussion/info. I'm not convinced that it's anything special. Bought one for a 5.56 build and I'm not sure it made any difference on that one either. I would not buy another one, of that brand. I know lots of people like them, but the idea is to make it different/better and I'm not sure that one does that for either of my rifles.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Phoenix, Arizona
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    2,846
    Quote Originally Posted by Hasher View Post
    12” groups at 600 yds also assumes a perfect hold and range estimation.

    We should be striving for something around 1” @ 100 who CB given most folks shooting skills is probably 12-15” at 600.
    I don't know.... A few years ago, I was running the Bench Rest Range at Ben Avery Shooting Facility, doing some instruction for some of my team and a couple of former Navy SEAL guys asked to use my range while I was conducting lecture. These guys work for POF and remarked about the 12.5" barrel on their .308 'AR' that gets MOA to 1k (ideal conditions, trained shooters, prone position, great optics). They related it was all about the muzzle crown (10.5 degrees) that permitted a short-barrel .308 to perform this well. This particular build was for the 'Teams' on military contract, they said. They were getting a ragged one-holer at 200 yards off the bench.
    "When one goes willingly into the darkness, all he will find there, is what he brought in with him".

    --Gabe Suarez, after the 7-11 shootout

    Proper development of the 'Warrior Spirit', training and physical conditioning before 'The Event' cannot be overstated.

    U.S. Army Rangers (1/75 'Old Scroll')
    CRG; 0-5 Feet CRG; PSP Pistol; FOF Instructor School; Combat Pistol Instructor School

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    849
    Man, you come up with this idea, right as I was getting ready to get a FAL from DSA. In all honesty, the modern AR-10 is better in every way, but... that FAL is just so COOL. Decisions, decisions...

    I can’t add anything more than what everyone else already has, beyond that I don’t think you can beat Geissele for a trigger.

    For using this as a battle rifle, rather than a DMR, do you think it would be better to shoot lighter bullets to maximize velocity out of the shorter 16” barrel? I’m thinking the Federal 130 grain SOST MK319 would be a good choice. Obviously the heavier stuff is better for DMR use, for velocity retention at range.
    - I am not in danger. I AM the danger.

    - Keep your rifle by your side.

  7. #57
    I know I already mentioned a SI branded trigger would be nice, as far as thst goes...
    A flat trigger that resembles your Glock triggers would be pretty slick.
    Be alert, stand firm in the faith, act like a man, be strong. Your every action must be done with love.

    “Adversity introduces a man to himself.”

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Prescott
    Posts
    1,177
    let me throw this in there, before things get anymore carried away, anything we do, will be done with DPMS pattern receivers not armalite.

    Do NOT call me an armorer
    Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum
    Now I am become Death, the destroyer of all worlds
    People have asked me if I consider myself a good or bad person. The truth of it is, I don't know or care. I have been called both. I like to think I have saved more lives than I have ended. Either way, I can still sleep at night.
    SEMPER FI

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Exiled in Texas
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    7,495
    Quote Originally Posted by chad newton View Post
    Most guys will probably get it and shoot 147g ball through them.
    The anticipated ammo should drive the decision about the barrel. I say anticipated, not planned, because you never really know what a barrel is going to prefer until you actually test it. I foresee using this gun in a sort of DMR-ish role, and I'm willing to spend more money on better ammo. Given that, I like the idea of a quality barrel, on the medium-to-heavy side, and a faster (1:10) twist.

    If someone knows that they plan to shoot a steady diet of M80 ball through their gun, then a 1:12 twist may be a better plan. I've got a SCAR 17, which I like but would not select for this project, and it has the slower 1:12 twist. One quirk of the gun is that it has a distinct preference for bullets in the 150 grain range. The Hornady 155gr AMAX or OTM are my top choices for that gun. But the AMAX and OTM actually only shoot a little bit better than M80 ball. But that's not a big disappointment, because that gun shoots ball ammo with surprising accuracy. The SCAR is not a sniper rifle, but with good ammo selection it is a solid 1 MOA performer. And it will achieve that 1 MOA level with cheap Federal XM80. In contrast, if you feed it premium match ammo in the 168-175gr range, the groups open up significantly. That gun really does not like heavy bullets.

    It's a good idea to consider the ammo first, and realistically appraise what you'll be putting through the gun.
    Virtute et Armis

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Manistee MI
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    1,426
    Quote Originally Posted by EDWARD DUNNIGAN View Post
    Keeping it simple: Aero receiver set, BCM BCG, 16" Ballistic Advantage Government profile barrel, B5 Systems SOPMOD stock, adjustable gas block, Smith Enterprises Vortex Flash Suppressor, La Rue makes the MBT trigger that is pretty nice without breaking the bank, same with CMMG internals. Fore end should be free floating, have an area to mount a front sight, and M-Lock for...stuff. Make and model can be any American company since it's not a structurally critical part.
    I will second the larue mbt trigger as an option. I have geisseles in all of my ARs but one has the mbt. Very similar trigger with similar quality materials and build quality.

    Soli Deo Gloria
    Abortion is sacrificing your child on the alter of convenience....Adrian Rogers
    Soli Deo Gloria

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