I'd love to see a the tribes interpretation of this pasage

[psalms23dad]

My pastor spoke on this passage last night.
I felt like its appropriate for our current times.

Isaiah 54 7-17

"For a brief moment I abandoned you, but with deep compassion I will bring you back.
8
In a surge of anger I hid my face from you for a moment, but with everlasting kindness I will have compassion on you," says the LORD your Redeemer.
9
"To me this is like the days of Noah, when I swore that the waters of Noah would never again cover the earth. So now I have sworn not to be angry with you, never to rebuke you again.
10
Though the mountains be shaken and the hills be removed, yet my unfailing love for you will not be shaken nor my covenant of peace be removed," says the LORD, who has compassion on you.
11
"O afflicted city, lashed by storms and not comforted, I will build you with stones of turquoise, your foundations with sapphires.
12
I will make your battlements of rubies, your gates of sparkling jewels, and all your walls of precious stones.
13
All your sons will be taught by the LORD, and great will be your children's peace.
14
In righteousness you will be established: Tyranny will be far from you; you will have nothing to fear. Terror will be far removed; it will not come near you.
15
If anyone does attack you, it will not be my doing; whoever attacks you will surrender to you.
16
"See, it is I who created the blacksmith who fans the coals into flame and forges a weapon fit for its work. And it is I who have created the destroyer to work havoc;
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no weapon forged against you will prevail, and you will refute every tongue that accuses you. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and this is their vindication from me," declares the LORD"

Lots to unpack but a few nuggets. Just to keep it in context, i don't think this was written to us so the lesson to me is seeing God's character and principles that he may be carrying out today. I'm not saying this is a prophetic word for today...

The Lord has and does judge a nation for the actions of the people. That judgment is for its own good. The Lord protects and prepares his people during those times for hardship and war. Ultimately vengeance is His and his people will be vindicated.
Having said that we are never allowed to set back and just watch, or shelter in place. The message through out scripture is always to go out.

[Papa]

I agree. Look at Psalm 91. The clear implication is that you are protected but must engage.

[res308]

I heard one preacher say something about God’s people thinking they can just sit back on their “blessed assurance” while others do the work. We are not living a spectator sport. People think God is always going to fight their battles for them and they don’t have to do anything. I don’t know where they found the Scripture to twist into that mentality. They have a fear of engaging. We are not called to be cowards.

[Ryan Taylor]

A lovely musical rendition. Lyrics are entirely scripture, nothing else added in. Its opens up with this scripture.

https://youtu.be/Zq-KhxsUxNo

[Ryan Taylor]

Individuals are to be judged for their individual sins. It is true that the son may suffer for the sins of the father, but we are judged according to our deeds both in this life and the next.

Nations, however, cannot recieve judgement in the next life because they are not living entities that carry on into the next. Therefore, nations are judged in this world, and punishment for NATIONAL SIN is carried out in this world.

Think of the sin if American slavery, as an example. As a nation, we both practiced it and tolerated it, and in the end reapt Gods judgement for it. It is estimated that probably all if the wealth ever accrued during the slave years was destroyed during the war.

All those, nations included, who seek the Lord will find Him. That is the promise. Those who do, prosper.

[ronlassit]

I think the message in Isaiah is prophetic and is specific to the nation of Israel, and concerns the last days. It speaks to that covenant made between the Jewish nation and God himself, as the new covenant Jesus Christ brought into the world did not exist at the time those words were uttered. We have seen the nation of Israel reemerge onto the world scene. It has and will in the future be attacked, but none of these shall triumph. God used war as a way to steer history into thr proper direction, and as a way to correct nations when they strayed from worshipping Him. We are there now as a nation ourselves. The analogy to slavery as a reason for national punishment is very weak. It smacks too much of "social justice" theology that has infiltrated and helped to destroy the church. The one instance of slavery seen in the Bible is seen in Philemon, where Paul urges Onesimus to return to his master, and for his master to treat him as a brother in Christ. Like it or not, the Bible does not equate slavery with sin. That is a human consruct. In fact it says just the opposite. We are all called to be slaves of Jesus Christ. We are, in fact, to emulate His behavior. If indeed we are to take the example of Jesus to heart, we should be very critical of our ungodly leaders who are, to a large degree, responsible for a lot of what we are seeing right now. 60 million murdered babies does not look good to God either. We are to be vocal, just as Jesus was in His day and if necessary knot some rawhide cords together and give a beat down to the money changers. One thing we must incorporate into our worldview is that God's ways are far beyond our own, and we do not understand. In one Sunday School class I used to attend I asked the loaded question, Is war evil? The almost unanimous response was yes. I then pointed out upon coming to the land of Caanan, God instructed Israel to destroy everything, including the livestock. I then said that if all war is evil, then God Himself is evil, and saying such a thing is far above my pay grade. There is a way which looks good to a man the path thereof leads to destruction. Guess what path we are on now? God is indeed judging this country now, because we have turned our backs on Him.

[Gary Hale]

I absolutely agree with Ronlassits assessement. His view is NOT typical "church" mentality. God's punishing Nations is NOT the punishing of all individuals, can you be caught up in the Nations punishment (whatever that means), sure. I am pleased to hear someone speaking of "slavery", it is evil when someone treats someone evil; people seem to love to slice and dice scripture to their thinking only. No, I'm not promoting slavery today, but don't ignore what is in scripture if you want to use it for your life guidance. God created everything, including "evil", consider that "evil" is a tool that is far beyond our understanding.

Sorry, everything in the bible isn't about us, like "churches" tend to teach. The referenced scripture is about those coming out of the captivity of Babylon, using very lofty language in an age many years ago. Not easy to understand Hebrew poetry, narrative and language that is very foriegn to us and also to the commentators that most turn to to understand such portions of scriptures.

[ronlassit]

Most so called Christians are too caught up in this world. We have to keep in mind that Jesus was not so concerned about this world. He understood the matrix. The Bible clearly states that everything we know will one day melt with a fervent heat. Being so, then everything we see about us is an illusion, it is not real in that it is not eternal. The Christ was about building His kingdom, which He clearly states, is not of this world. He understood clearly that to build His kingdom he had to freely give up His life. His last words on this world were about building His kingdom. Go ye into every nation and preach. We are to be in the world but not of the world. All of history is centered around two similar events, the coming of Jesus Christ. First he came as A baby, to be the Savior. His second advent will be as Conquerer We already know how that works out. True and unbiased justice will be meted out. The reign of the powers and principalities of the air will be brought to an end. Only then will we know true freedom. What we are witnessing in this nation are the results of US turning our backs toward God. The process is pretty clearly defined in the first chapter of Romans. He has lifted his hand off of this nation. God does so to attempt to call a nation back into His fold. As it was in the first advent, the world is being prepared for the second. The chess pieces are being moved around. It is great consolation to know true believers will not have to endure the wrath of God during the last days, which I believe we are on the cusp of. There is the rapture. Even the remnant left during the tribulation, those bearing the mark of God, will not suffer His judgements. Let us walk up rightly in faith until He comes. Even so, come Lord Jesus.

[Papa]

Most so called Christians are too caught up in this world. We have to keep in mind that Jesus was not so concerned about this world. He understood the matrix. The Bible clearly states that everything we know will one day melt with a fervent heat. Being so, then everything we see about us is an illusion, it is not real in that it is not eternal. The Christ was about building His kingdom, which He clearly states, is not of this world. He understood clearly that to build His kingdom he had to freely give up His life. His last words on this world were about building His kingdom. Go ye into every nation and preach. We are to be in the world but not of the world. All of history is centered around two similar events, the coming of Jesus Christ. First he came as A baby, to be the Savior. His second advent will be as Conqueror. We already know how that works out. True and unbiased justice will be meted out. The reign of the powers and principalities of the air will be brought to an end. Only then will we know true freedom. What we are witnessing in this nation are the results of US turning our backs toward God. The process is pretty clearly defined in the first chapter of Romans. He has lifted his hand off of this nation. God does so to attempt to call a nation back into His fold. As it was in the first advent, the world is being prepared for the second. The chess pieces are being moved around. It is great consolation to know true believers will not have to endure the wrath of God during the last days, which I believe we are on the cusp of. There is the rapture. Even the remnant left during the tribulation, those bearing the mark of God, will not suffer His judgements. Let us walk up rightly in faith until He comes. Even so, come Lord Jesus.

Us, and U.S.

"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." --Romans 12:2 KJV

P.S. I don't believe the Rapture will haul me out of here when the bell rings. And as a Christian I expect to suffer before I check out. My Boss did. As for the rest, absolutely.

[ronlassit]

I was wondering if anyone would catch that. I must have given the impression that we as Christians will not suffer for our faith. Given what I see as coming, I do not think many of us will be able to. We have seen the subtle tactics , but they are going to get more overt. Those in power not have no moral compass, therefore there are no laws or social mores that will limit their desire to rid themselves of our presence. As long as they think they can get by with it, they will attempt it. There is a bright side to it, though. Where there is persecution the church grows. I sincerely hope it will be the case going forward.