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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
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    4,927
    It's the 1950's American business model. Look at Detroit. You know those little cars will never sell.

    Or Colt. High visibility sights? Ambidextrous safeties? Reliability? A decent double action option? High capacity? No. Buy what we make, pay a premium for it and be thankful we're willing to sell to you at all.
    Warrior for the working day.

    Es una cosa muy seria. --Robert Capa

    "...I rode the range in a Ford V8...Yippy Yi Yo Ki Yay." --Johnny Mercer (as modified)

    "What cannot be remedied must be endured."

    Vale et omnia quae.

    P:20

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    NW Washington
    Posts
    3,037
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa View Post
    It's the 1950's American business model. Look at Detroit. You know those little cars will never sell.

    Or Colt. High visibility sights? Ambidextrous safeties? Reliability? A decent double action option? High capacity? No. Buy what we make, pay a premium for it and be thankful we're willing to sell to you at all.
    All very true. Sadly.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    1,337
    Sorta like H&K. American businesses haven’t cornered the market on arrogance.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    851
    I stand corrected. Apparently this thing is actually real. I really thought it was somebody’s idea of a prank when I saw it, kind of like the old “Homeboy Night Sights.” It’s just so.... ridiculous... that I didn’t think it could be real, much less made by Leupold of all companies.
    - I am not in danger. I AM the danger.

    - Keep your rifle by your side.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    NWFL
    Posts
    16,531
    Quote Originally Posted by Huntindoc View Post
    Trying to be objective. Kudos to leupold for trying to build a better mouse trap. I recognize that the battery and electronics need to go somewhere. The execution of the battery hanging off of the back of the gun however appears poorly done.

    If they were able to add some of the electronics to the body and turn the battery perpendicular to the slide it might work a little better. They could consider making the rear plate integrated into the design. Of course they would then need different models or adaptors for each brand but it appears they are already doing that.
    I agree with your point of view on this. I look upon this as an evolutionary attempt to improve miniature RDSs. Using the analogy of evolution, many such attempts get a reverse darwin award and fail. I still applaud the attempt. With out trying to change, optics will not improve.

    This calls for very innovative designers that can design a gun and RDS optic together. Probably needs to be outside the box, but must still be a useful design. What would the tribe here like to see in an innovative RDS for carry pistols. The biggest issue is finding RDSs for small concealable pistols that are practical. Maybe a pop up lens that lays flat or recessed when the gun is holstered?

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    621
    Quote Originally Posted by barnetmill View Post
    I agree with your point of view on this. I look upon this as an evolutionary attempt to improve miniature RDSs. Using the analogy of evolution, many such attempts get a reverse darwin award and fail. I still applaud the attempt. With out trying to change, optics will not improve.

    This calls for very innovative designers that can design a gun and RDS optic together. Probably needs to be outside the box, but must still be a useful design. What would the tribe here like to see in an innovative RDS for carry pistols. The biggest issue is finding RDSs for small concealable pistols that are practical. Maybe a pop up lens that lays flat or recessed when the gun is holstered?
    I think it's going to have to start with a gun designed around an RDS. Meaning that the firing pin and other innards in the slide have been arranged to allow a very deep mounting. The only thing that should protrude above the top of the slide should be the screen of the RDS. Whether or not that folds down is another question...I could see a spring-loaded screen that doubles as an ON/OFF switch. Mounting the battery on the side or back of the slide may also be an option to minimize size...just not the way that Leupold has tried to do it.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western WA
    Posts
    6,485
    One of the benefits of a red dot is how it assists with racking the slide. Folding out of the way is not a useful feature in this regard, particularly since it would be a critical failure point.

    But When they figure out how to project a holographic dot without a glass window to look through, then we’ll have something intriguing.
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

  8. #28
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    NWFL
    Posts
    16,531
    If the lens pops up upon drawing it would serve and anyway I was always able to rack the slide without an RMR on the gun.
    But yes a polarized red dot floating in air would be great. Maybe by that time we will have energy guns.

    The above is just day dreaming, but one never knows what the future will bring.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western WA
    Posts
    6,485
    Quote Originally Posted by barnetmill View Post
    If the lens pops up upon drawing it would serve and anyway I was always able to rack the slide without an RMR on the gun.
    Yes it would serve but it’s still a big potential failure point. Of course anything man made can fail, but some failures are more likely than others.

    In the 19th century, folding guards on sabres were really popular. It was a cool idea. Hell, it was a great idea. Consider that swords were WORN a lot more than they were USED to fight with...so anything that made carrying more comfortable and convenient was a good thing.

    Unless, of course, if they were prone to breaking and failing when that extra protection was needed. And they often failed.

    So what does that have to do with red dots? Nothing, other than history of mechanical devices in combat has lessons to teach. Innovation is a wonderful thing and we should always push for better ideas and better execution of those ideas. But we also understand that shit breaks and the less potential failure points are part if the design, the better.

    Yes, there are always tradeoffs and sometimes the drawbacks are outweighed by the benefits. But when chasing benefits we should do our best to eliminate drawbacks.


    We can all rack a slide one handed with a decent set of sights. It’s still easier with an RMR. And some of the tangled up fighting positions we find ourselves in, every sliver of help is a good thing.

    340942A3-080F-4E48-AFF3-6289E349ADDC.jpg
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western WA
    Posts
    6,485
    On the other hand, we accept compromises with smaller guns, things that need deeper concealment, etc. So a folding red dot may well be a useful thing in certain applications.

    One just has to weight the benefits and drawbacks.
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

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