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Thread: WHAT IS IT FOR?

  1. #11
    Ill try my hand at this.

    1. Role for me is EDC. The distances these should be able to be employed from is anywhere between 0-100 yards. They are something you should ALWAYS have with you and be profiecent with these are your primary weapons in the civilan world and as such their niche is very general if properly setup and with a user of high skill.
    2. Role for me is either backup to EDC or as an NPE carry. These are smaller guns so I dont feel as comfortable at longer ranges with them I believe these are best for 0-25 yards. Maybe if setup right out to 50 but thats beyond my skillset. Their niche is a small weapon used for up close work that can be VERY well hidden so no matter what the occasion you are always armed with a ballistic option. but the downsides to them are capacity (usually) and accuracy at longer pistol ranges (50-100 yards)
    3. Role for me is home defense. These are DEVASTATING inside structures and close ranges 0-50 yards. Niche for these guns are home defense,vehicle gun, woods gun or proactively clearing structures of bg's in more of a team or department setting.
    4. I dont currently have a role for this. They are great for accuracy at longer pistol ranges 100-150 yards but I see more limitations then advantages at least in my outlook/roles as a civilian and if I am going to something that size Im opting for a rifle caliber option. But honestly I still want one like a CZ Scorpion.
    5. Roles for me. home defense,car gun, WROL setup, woods gun.Their effective envelope for me is 0-200 yards.These systems are great they combine (at least the well put together ones) the size of a PCC with the more powerful rifle cartridges. They also have the benefit of supression length. So with a supressed sbr/pistol it will run shorter then a rifle length system thats supressed. This would be the way I would elevate my loadout IF I had to which TBH probably wont happen to that extent. Not impossible but just not very likely.
    6. Roles for me are the same to the sbr length system but if I have an sbr/pistol ill grab that over this in my setting (urban) now if I am doing more rural stuff like some of the tribe does I might be more apt to grab a longer rifle. Yeah itll be a pain to move with (somewhat ar's arent exactly heavy) but if I know the ranges are a bit longer im grabbing a full length system. The envelope for this system for me is 0-400 yards or further dependent on caliber. Niche for this system is for mid range engagements with the possibility of close range. Also something I shouldve put for the sbr system is these have more barrier defeating properties then pistol caliber systems do.
    7. Roles for me hunting,target shooting,WROL. I dont have ANY experience shooting these kinds of rifles so I dont know what my envelope with this system would look like.

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    1,213
    They’re all tools, tools for specific jobs. And just like the tools in a jobox on the job site, you may only use a specific tool once. But it is the correct tool for that specific job.

    1. Full-size and compact handguns. Glock 17 and 19. The weapon that should always be with you. I carry a 17 everyday as my edc, as my build allows me to effectively conceal it. The everyday carry pistol is not only used for defensive purposes, there could be times where you would introduce it into a situation for offensive purposes. Full size guns are easier to fight with due to the ease of manipulation.

    2. Subcompact, microguns. For deep concealment. Me personally, I can’t stand micro keychain guns because I have large hands. A Glock 26 is about the smallest gun I would ever carry. Hell I had Glock 21 under my suit jacket when I got married. However, in a NPE where getting caught can mean lock up or death, these guns have their place. They’re also easier to ditch down a sewer grate than a full size pistol.

    3. Shotgun. The ultimate close range weapon. Very versatile with the variety of types of rounds available. From breaching rounds to buckshot for perps, to slugs for extending the range, less lethal, incendiary rounds, and so on. The pistol grip shotguns make them super handy to pack in the vehicle to bring some overwhelming violence to the fight.

    4. Pistol caliber carbines. Very niche weapon. Good for vehicle borne situations, indoors or other confined spaces. The ones that take Glock mags have the benefit of sharing mags with your pistol, if something catastrophic happens with either your carbine or pistol, provided you carry a Glock. Easy to suppress. However if not suppressed, you won’t be bleeding from the ears if you shoot one of these indoors without ear pro.

    5. SBR, braced pistols. Good weapon for close to intermediate ballistics. Also great tool for vehicle operations. These along with the PCC’s have the ability to transport very clandestinely. Especially with a folding stock. However, unsurpressed, these things will ring your bell firing in confined spaces or indoors. Muzzle blast is par for the course. I wouldn’t want to fire one in a meth lab without a good can on the end.

    6. Full length rifle caliber 16” barrel or longer. The 16” AR is my go to war gun. Short enough to be handy, but long enough to have good ballistics out to 400 yards. With the accuracy to go with those ballistics. Some type of red dot is usually the flavor of optic. With a LPVO these weapons can provide overwatch for a crew actively engaged in something. The 18” barrel with a 1-8X optic has the ability to be fast at close range and at 8X be able to bust someone’s dome at 300 yards.

    7. Full length rifles with high powered optics. The sniper’s rifle. Something designed to reach out past 800 yards with some oomph. .308, .300 win mag, .338 lapua, .416 Barrett, .50 bmg. Anti personnel or anti material.
    Last edited by WOLF220; 01-26-2020 at 12:44 AM.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Grand Prairie, TX
    Posts
    721
    Non-military, like myself: (how these fit in MY life)



    1. Full size and compact Handguns. -Every day carry. Fills multiple roles in a pyramid concept but at its most narrow, excels at its “main purpose,” and then stretches its capabilities well. That is at its best, it’s concealable and easily deployed and, with an appropriately installed optic, can make life easier in a bunch of other spots by broadening it’s depth and distance.

    2. Subcompact small size handguns. -Fills a small void of either extreme NPE like others have mentioned or as others have mentioned, when dress calls for something capable but slim.

    3. Shotguns - Home defense. Riot control. Small learning curve for manual of operations. Most anyone with a brain can effectively use after a small amount of teaching, therefore IN A PINCH, can hand off to a family member not familiar with an auto loading pistol or rifle. Becomes a problem then if it jams. Most effective when focused teaching breaches past just the typical manual of arms and the nuisances are learned then applied.

    4. Pistol caliber rifles or as I call them...Songs. -I would say for me, consolidating resources or otherwise needing to travel REALLY light but really far. If you’re going to carry a rifle, I say carry a rifle however, maybe something with a few Glock happy sticks and the like PROVIDED you’re already carrying a Glock as your “number 1.” Also easy to stick in a bag and go.

    5. Short SBR-esque rifle caliber weapons. -CQB/militiaman usage. I live in a small apartment so this may be useful for the cramped spaces but so is a Glock with an optic. Can also be used at moderate distance if this is your only rifle.

    6. Full length rifle caliber weapons (16" barrel or longer). -Similar role to number 5. Can be used at longer distances. The platform itself can dictate distance parameters just with a longer barrel alone. Piston versus gas doesn’t matter to somebody like me, take care of your crap, know how to use it, it will take care of you. Rifle optics with secondary magnifiers on both 5 and 6 are necessary for optimal usage but honestly, learn to kick some ass with a proper rifle and you can make a lot of stuff happen with 5 and 6. For civilian use, keep the Navy SEAL stuff hanging off the rails to a minimum. I like to be mobile.

    7. Full length rifles with high powered optics. -Distance: hunting for food and otherwise. (Also a lesson in patience)




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Chris

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,667
    I gotta ask. Why do you call pistol caliber carbines "songs?"

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    177
    Without having more details:

    1) Full size and compact pistols: Personal Defense

    2) Small size handguns: Back-up

    3) Shotguns: Problems between 25 and 50 yards.

    4,5,6) An AK-47 or similar can be used for problems between 50 and 300 yards.

    7) Problems at more than 300 yards.

    Fast summary with the given details.
    Don't be scared be prepared!

    If guns were outlaw only outlaws will have guns - NRA

    Nothing happens until it happens!

    Si vis pacem para bellum

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Southeast Florida
    Posts
    1,796
    With the goal of being brief but pithy...

    1. Full size and compact Handguns: EDC obviously, full-size especially for open carry when appropriate, so that you always have a gun with you

    2. Subcompact small size handguns: for EDC when circumstances or physical condition don't allow something bigger, to back up the bigger EDC, and generally to further ensure you always have a gun with you

    3. Shotguns: for maximum effect on target within appropriate range, whether proactive or reactive

    4. Pistol caliber rifles or as I call them...Songs: for a special application such as as the desire for stealth, concealment, minimum recoil, specific bullet performance, or when the physical attributes of the shooter don't allow use of a rifle-caliber

    5. Short SBR-esque rifle caliber weapons: for applications where a shotgun is not precise enough, a longer barrel is not needed due to range, and/or the potential for many targets increases the value of high magazine capacity

    6. Full length rifle caliber weapons (16" barrel or longer): similar to SBRs, but when higher bullet velocity is desired which is usually due to increased range of engagement

    7. Full length rifles with high powered optics: for when even longer range is involved, and/or the desire for more powerful calibers to deliver a certain impact on the target (vehicles, body armor, instant kill at distance, etc.)

  7. #17
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Beyond The Wall
    Posts
    46,330
    (NO....Damned Spellcheck Fuckery....SMG...as in SUBMACHINEGUNS)
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  8. #18
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Beyond The Wall
    Posts
    46,330
    So all of that said...in your current state in life, what are the most important to you?

    What have overlapping missions and of those, which would you likely choose for each application?

    And based on a realistic perusal of realistic types, locations, and nature of your likely contacts, what will you most likely use in a fight?
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    1,677
    In my current state of life the following are most important to me and I have multiples of what is important.

    1. Fighting handgun. G17-19 and their equivalents from other manufacturers. Preferably with an RMR

    2. Back up guns. To me this is the J Frame and the Baby Glock (with RDS) and the last ditch hideout/NPE gun.

    3. Shotgun. Just like Gabe runs them. Stripped down and light. Plus of course a Tac-14.

    6. Full size battle rifles. I run mine in 308 and prefer the FAL but I also have options in HK and M1A.

    7. Long range precision guns. Whether for people or hunting these are 4th most important to me.

    After that it does not matter to me I guess the AR platform guns as I can configure them to be task specific.
    I carry two kinds of trauma kits. One for fixing it and one for causing it.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Southeast Florida
    Posts
    1,796
    I'd rank them almost in your order, with the most critical at the top and then as I go down the list they become less of a "need" and more of a "want". Higher in the list = more likely to be used, and higher items can overlap down, but lower items don't overlap up as much:

    1. small handgun, because it's most likely to be always there even if I'm just lounging around the house in minimal clothing

    2. compact handgun (1 and 2 are close to a tie, easily could switch position)

    3. shotgun

    4. short SMG

    5. short rifle

    6. longer rifle

    7. even longer rifle

    That being said, this is in the context of "normal" life. When you cross the line to consider breakdown of civil society, whether a Katrina or something worse, then the items lower on the list become much more important, which is why I still want them in the safe!

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