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  1. #81
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    8,157
    I will tell you this, the columbine costume should be as big as a trigger to use deadly force as someone punching you in the face. He should have been drawn on as soon as he walked in the door. Shot when presented the gun or sooner(stupid games win stupid prizes). Speed has nothing to do with it, itís all about timing.... Do you think the gun fighters of the passed killed so many by being indecisive in there actions and follow through. The ones that hesitated like the fat man in the back got killed. Perfect presentation on why you donít hesitate. If all of you want the biggest lesson, thatís it and prepare mentally and physically for the event that will happen. You canít think maybe, you have to set you intentions or it will inevitably be bad for you.
    Nothing says Fuck You like a shotgun.....

  2. #82
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    8,157
    Don’t be the fat man in the back, that’s going to be my new quote....
    Nothing says Fuck You like a shotgun.....

  3. #83
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    340
    As I read through the last few pages of comments, I kept thinking of how to summarize what those who made mistakes (and unfortunately lost their lives due to their mistakes) lacked that produced a fatal mistake. At first I thought of saying that one must be a fighter first and foremost, and a firearm is only one tool of a fighter (jumping off mike135's posts and the responses); but then it occurred to me that merely being a fighter isn't enough, and it misses the point.

    Then I thought of saying that one must be a killer, but that seemed to imply (to the public mind—yes yes, I know what to think about that) an image like unto a caveman swinging a femur.

    So here I am, back at Gentleman Killer. Funny how that and the necessary paradigmatic elements are elucidated here already. That is my self-image now, as I sit in a coffeeshop, working during some down time between sis's wedding preparations, armed and ready to kill anyone necessary. That doesn't mean I wouldn't potentially go to hands first, if necessary. But trench-coated fellow with a fake beard and an odd gait comes in, I have my plan already, because I can see two out of the three entrances. I don't look to kill someone, but I have no compunction about doing so, should the need arise.

    Ah, screw it, I've not said anything new. This really isn't rocket science.

  4. #84
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Phoenix, Arizona
    Posts
    9,954
    like unto a caveman swinging a femur
    I like to swing a humorous.... it's funnier
    Greg "Hyena" Nichols
    Instagram: tacfit_az
    Facebook: SI Instructor Greg Nichols

    #thinkinginviolence
    #tactisexual

    Always entertaining, mildly offensive
    IANative: Indeed, when you grab Brent (or he grabs you), it feels like liquid unobtanium wrapped in rawhide... whereas Greg is just solid muscle wrapped in hate, seasoned w/ snuff and a little lead.

    http://www.warriortalk.com/showthrea...he-Obscenities

  5. #85
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    340
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Nichols View Post
    I like to swing a humorous.... it's funnier
    Hittin' my funny bone with that humerus.

  6. #86
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    1,070
    Bwahahaha! well played...

    I spent more time contemplating what I would have done if presented with what has been shown inside the building. That said, Gabe and others have obviously pointed out the need (and ability) to interdict outside. While I do not disagree at all with the indicators that have been pointed out, I'm curious if anyone has seen any descriptions or views of what DID go on outside?

    Like New Zealand, was this guy walking for blocks up to the church dressed and acting this way? If so, they obviously need to improve their perimeter procedures. Was he approached at all?

  7. #87
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Southeast Florida
    Posts
    1,799
    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Yamamoto View Post
    Itís not binary.

    re-read Gabeís post #71.
    Sorry if I wasn't clear. The binary reference wasn't referring to the topic but to the dynamics of the conversation, the idea that somebody must either be right or wrong, and if there is a disagreement it implies that one person is saying the other is wrong. Seems to me that most things in life aren't black and white. Instead of wrong vs right, it's often more about good/better/best or bad/worse/worst. It would be nice if conversations like this didn't quickly turn into a question about who's right and who's wrong.

  8. #88
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    8,157
    It’s pretty black a white, if you do the wrong things you are dead.... Right or wrong that is how it is...
    Nothing says Fuck You like a shotgun.....

  9. #89
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    19
    Let me simplify my personal mindset:


    • Wig, fake beard, trechcoat wearing weirdo stranger shows up to my church with hands hidden and bulge in coat -- FIGHT HAS BEGUN.




    • The INSTANT I notice/see the above, then I know I'm now in a FIGHT FOR MY LIFE AND FAMILY (and others). I'm already behind the curve, but the longer the shitbag waits, the more time I have to catch up.



    It is time to convert yourself from PREY into PREDATOR. Hunted into Hunter. Victim into Killer.


    • Two choices*** - FIGHT or FLIGHT


    ***I pre-choose FIGHT. This is because I cannot live with myself knowing I had a gun and the ability and I ran out of the building and let dozens of MY people die. There's more to life than LIFE. Sacred Honor is a real thing. Secondly, fight also gives better odds than flight. Again, depends on where everyone is in the church, number of people etc...This is technically not decided at this time, it is decided in advance. (some trainers I think are awful by instilling too much mental and emotional baggage into students regarding fight or flight, one must simplify their threat response procedure and for me, that means removing unnecessary steps, one of which is training your mind to have to make an unnecessary decision. There is afterall, a flow-chart sort of mental decision making process and fight or flight compounds it greatly. All things being equal, if person A is on fight/flight decision, person B who has that predecided is instead already on a latter decision regarding assessment/timing/position/execution. All of this might take just a second - but many gunfights are won or lost in less than a second)



    • I would try [if possible] to position myself directly behind the shitbag without alerting him. No such thing as a fair fight, I have ZERO issues with shooting the shitbag in the back multiple times. Zero reservation shooting someone to the ground. Zero reservation putting more rounds into a grounded threat.




    • I would have pistol drawn. If standing, covert ready behind the thigh, hopefully near side wall. If sitting, in my hands in lap area. Or at the very least, hand on pistol while concealed.




    • I personally would need to see a lethal force threat before initiating lethal force, meaning he would need to present a firearm or I would need to see possession in hand. I just need to see his hands touch it. That's it. Or if concealed, the instant it is being presented. Anything before that can be tried as murder. Even in pro-gun states, there are hostile prosecutors and brainwashed DUMB AS ROCKS jurors. I been in jury selection process...one of the scariest things in America is the idea of having your life rest on jurors in our society.


    I feel that strategically positioned, with hand on pistol or drawn and semi-concealed I would be able to fully present and get shots on body before he could fully present and get a shot off. If nothing materializes, all the better - time to review tape and talk to the police. If it does, I will end it. No guarantees in any of this, but all I can do is maximize my advantage and odds.



    ***

    This all sounds great and all, 20/20 and what not. But that's not what the above is or my intent. I almost always run defensive scenarios in my head in almost every environment I'm in. This is why at church I sit in a corner. 90 degrees to have to scan instead of 360. I sit where I can see points of entry. This is at church, restaurants and anywhere else. I never get immersed in anything in public. That is reserved for the relative safety of my home. Doesn't matter what the activity is. I don't get immersed in prayer or scripture since that lowers my awareness. I also do not drink in public. Humans should not be treated any different than wild and dangerous game. If a you were in the African plains known to be infested with dangerous animals, you wouldn't be at ease. Would you sit down and get heads down invested in a deep game of chess out on the Serengeti? Why do people feel at ease around dozens or hundreds of strangers who are more dangerous than the most dangerous animals? Human predators specifically target the weak and unaware even more so. They are looking for the biggest possible advantage they can and force discrepancy they can.


    I've been that way all my life. When I was younger, I thought maybe I'm a freakin psycho or paranoid person. Wrong.

    I'm actually the normal one, and all the brainwashed sheep are the ones who have deviated from their God given nature. Paranoia is not the same as awareness. Natural selection used to weed out all the "condition white" people until the modern era...which is why we have so many clueless people out there. Less hardships in life means less consequences in life and so people are soft and mentally weak. You have to be an alpha. You have to be "edgy" by today's standards. Mainstream means stupid. People don't even see where their food comes from and are irked at the sight of a cow being milked. They are even more separated from the reality of genuine human cruelty. Savage acts and the such. Just how horrible and violent things can be. Total lack of mercy. Complete evil.

    You can't imagine the relief and euphoria I experienced when in my early 20's I discovered Cooper's stuff and Suarez and some others. I didn't grow up in a gun family. The whole "have a plan to kill anyone in the room" ...damn right.

    I was pretty good at a sport. One thing that separated regular people from semi-pros and pros was the ability to visualize what is about to happen or what you're about to do. Any serious sports coach will tell you this. The more powerful, deep and real the pre-visualization is - the more successful the execution. Even in situations where you cannot predict the behavior of others. Visualization of your own skills and execution is important. There is nothing to be ashamed of to visualize killing someone. After all, it is a defensive visualization in that context, not a murder visualization.

    It also makes you faster in timing / response (not physically directly since you are only as fast as you are based on your fitness, but indirectly as a result of economy of motion and economy of process). Your mind's clock runs faster than real-time. So you are mentally "pushing" reality, which is physical limits of your hands, feet, body. Maximizing what you have, and cutting out baggage.

  10. #90
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Arizona's Desert
    Posts
    242
    This discussion seems to have about died, but I'm going to give a shot of Narcan.

    One of the things that bothered me was an approximately 5 second lapse between the time that the assailant began pulling the gun out of concealment to the time the first victim is shot. I reviewed the video with a second by second pause. Below is approximately what happens, second by second.

    6 seconds: The assailant begins pulling the gun from concealment.

    8 seconds: He has leveled the weapon mid body at his first intended victim, but... nothing. Victim begins to stand and acquire his weapon from concealment.

    9 seconds: The assailant brings the weapon down to waist level, the muzzle is elevated 45 degrees while backing up; his body posture suggests that he's chambering a round.. I believe he came into this with an empty chamber, realized this when the gun went "click". He created distance and corrected his error.

    10 seconds: Assailant levels his gun at mid body as originally intended.

    11 seconds: First victim goes down.

    We can talk about missed cues and situational awareness, but in my book the big, number one fail is the inability to act and do so swiftly. From the time that the bad guy tipped his hand as to intent, to the time the first shot was fired 5 seconds lapsed. Not only was he not stopped, but he was allowed to clear his failure to feed/fire malfunction and resume. Armed and unarmed church goers had the ability to stop this, but failed to act.

    The failure to act swiftly/decisively is the number one fail.
    Last edited by Cacti Rat; 01-04-2020 at 12:39 PM.

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