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  1. #1
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    Default Aikido throw explained with Karate

    Per another thread...

    Wrist grabs are more common than people think. Itís useful to have some skills to deal with them.

    Releasing yourself from a grab isnít usually too difficult, unless of course the attacker is much bigger than you. This is why itís especially important for women and kids to actually learn some of these things.

    But out sometimes we donít want the guy to let go...at least not until we are done with him. This is for one of those times.

    My dojo partner Randy demonstrates the Aikido throw, and I show how itís also just like Karate. People familiar with Karate stuff will probably appreciate it more but hopefully thereís something for everyone.

    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

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    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

  2. #2
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    My limited knowledge of the subject is that what is done in Aikido is much more effective that what is taught in judo relative to grabs. Judo was very sanitized relative to joint torsion and twisting moves. Judo using what is is designed not to injure so much and not to be so painful to practice. This was all in keeping to the sporting intention of judo, but of course just like in college wresting one can fight using judo techniques and Aikido and Karate go together a lot better and that really starts to lead one to what jujitsu was at one time.
    I am most interested in how to break a grab. Some of the pain causing techniques seem to not always be as effective in causing pain in some people versus others. I am not sure why. A major value in learning such things is knowing how to defend against them.

  3. #3
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    Big generalizations to follow...

    Judo uses a lot of what I call “core throws”. By this I mean the throw is executed by manipulating the opponent’s center, stealing their balance and often times physically picking them up before dumping them. I think of these mostly as variations on a hip throw.

    Judo also has a lot of tripping and sweeping techniques. For the comparison to Aikido you can think of this as an extremity attack; it’s aimed at the lower body, somewhere in the legs.

    Aikido also has a lot of core throws, but rather than physically picking up the body, they involve manipulating the other guy’s spine and timing. Much less muscle is required, but the techniques are also somewhat less forgiving (i.e. you better not fuck it up).

    Aikido also performs a lot of extremity throws, but these are with the upper body. Manipulation of spine and stealing balance is effected through the connection through the arms. These are often the things you see done in response to a wrist grab (though they can certainly be applied from other attacks as well).


    The common root of both Aikido and Judo is Jujutsu. But they evolved differently for different contexts and needs.


    Aikido (and it’s close antecedent Aikijutsu) makes a lot more sense when you realize it was designed for people who were armed. The reason Aikido is “soft” is because you’re not cutting the other guy in half. It is also designed to get your hands free ASAP while at the same time tossing the other guy away from you and into his friends. The idea is someone has grabbed your wrists/arm/shoulder with the intent of stopping you from drawing your weapon.

    This is is different from just releasing your grip to either escape or to hit the other guy. It’s a release that damages not only the initial attacker but also his buddies.


    I am not a fan of pain compliance stuff...yeah it’s good to know but it’s too dicey to count on. MECHANICAL compliance is better. But taking away the other guy’s balance and eliminating his ability to do damage to you is what’s best, IMO.
    Brent Yamamoto
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor

    Ready, willing, able. Bring it.

    Instagram: karate_at_1200fps

    Upcoming classes:

    Pistol Groundfighting, Texas

  4. #4
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    Great explanation in Karate terms Brent. Thanks
    I am in a sunny place full of shady people

  5. #5
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    Jan 2011
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    Good video. I've never been a huge martial arts guy, few years of Shotokan. But when I was working as a LEO, most of our arrest and control was based on Akidio. The Koga method. Pretty good stuff.

  6. #6
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    Aug 2005
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    Brent can you please describe the Arm-Lock at the end of the technique, applied after the attacker has being taken to the ground. In the thread Christians are Weird.

    The hand not holding the attacker`s wrist sort of circles behind the Outside of the attackers elbow and then locks the arm out.

    The way I apply an Arm-Lock is to twist the Wrist, Hyper-extending the arm while pressing down on the first two knuckles of the hand and then lifting the attackers wrist up-The fingers of the attackers hand pointing upwards. This locks his wrist and arm in place.

    You can then strengthen the technique by pressing down on the outside of the elbow, by letting go with one hand and using the Forearm of that hand. Assisting you in getting the attacker to the ground. Then adding a knee to pin the arm to the ground once the attacker is prone.

    It seems adding the Arm Circle thing strengthens the Lock. Providing an extra layer of security, by keeping the arm in place, preventing the attacker from pulling it free.

    OSSU!
    Elfie
    HALFMAN HALFCAR

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by barnetmill View Post
    My limited knowledge of the subject is that what is done in Aikido is much more effective that what is taught in judo relative to grabs. Judo was very sanitized relative to joint torsion and twisting moves. Judo using what is is designed not to injure so much and not to be so painful to practice. This was all in keeping to the sporting intention of judo, but of course just like in college wresting one can fight using judo techniques and Aikido and Karate go together a lot better and that really starts to lead one to what jujitsu was at one time.
    I am most interested in how to break a grab. Some of the pain causing techniques seem to not always be as effective in causing pain in some people versus others. I am not sure why. A major value in learning such things is knowing how to defend against them.
    To follow on Brent's great post:

    The founder of Judo, Jigoro Kano, studied mostly Tenjin Shinyo Ryu jujutsu, and later Kito Ryu, before founding Judo in the post-Meiji era. Judo's founding occurred during the Westernization of Japan, and rooted judo firmly in a non-warrior tradition as compared to its progenitor arts. It became something more akin to highschool wrestling with a strong mix of conformist nationalism.

    The founder of Aikido, Morihei Ueshiba, was licensed in Daito Ryu jujutsu (as opposed to licenses in Daito Ryu aikijujutsu). Though aikido was founded a generation after Judo, it, too, was post-Meiji in origin. Which is to say that it had medieval DNA, but modern curriculum.

    Both arts differ dramatically from medieval era jujutsu in many critical ways, but specifically germain to this discussion is that both are 'civilianized'. Both are designed for practice by unarmed civilians as opposed to a warrior-caste armed professional. Wrist grabs are actually pretty common in weaponized environments (which is to say anywhere outside of a cage/ring). Whenever a suspect reaches for their waistband, an officer will generally either smother the suspect's draw or make space and draw on the suspect. And the reverse is true. Much of human violence occurs at 'bad breath' distances (we do an awful lot of talking before fighting), and there is often ample opportunity for various kinds of grabbing, either of shirts/jackets, wrists, forearms, bearhugs, etc. The way that an armed person responds to these threats, and the ways that armed people illicit these grabs, is an area of study that doesn't go out of style, as it were.

    Many of the core principles of jujutsu, however, carried on in certain lines of Judo and Aikido. Brent's descriptions of Judo using 'core' throws is spot on. As is his discussion of Aikido using 'spine' throws or offbalancing. Aikido maintains a diverse curriculum of grabs towards the distal arms, while Judo typically revolves around more traditional wrestling grabs closer to the collar bones of the opponent. I guess that the point of the history lesson is that it is important to ask what a martial art was designed to accomplish in order to know if the goals of the art are in line with your goals as a fighter.
    Last edited by noonesshowmonkey; 07-25-2019 at 06:43 PM. Reason: spelling
    There is no hunting like the hunting of man, and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never care for anything else thereafter.
    ~Ernest Hemingway

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