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Thread: AR 15 Pistols

  1. #11
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    Yes I have a RMR pistol - I want a rifle because unlike them and what they provide

  2. #12
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    The 5.56 was designed for a 20 inch barrel.
    The .300? A 9 inch barrel.

    If short is the goal I only see one option.
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by roll tide View Post
    I want a gun to hide in a back pack to carry with me concealed
    To what end?

    To be a hero at the mall shooting? Do what you can with your RMR pistol and then stick it back in your holster. Then maybe the cops won't blow your head off when they arrive.

    As a "get home" gun for the Zombie Apocalypse? I guess I could go for that but the odds are vanishingly slim of anything like that happening and again, the Pistol or Stakeout is likely as good.

    As a traffic-jam riot gun? Meh...drive on. Or use a Stakeout. The AR has too much penetration in a crowd.

    As a bear and cougar deterrent on the trail? OK, but a stakeout is lighter and harder to miss with. But an AR pistol in 300 BLK would be fine as well. But don't carry it in a backpack for that...way too slow. Sling it.

    As a home-defense gun? Subsonic 300 BLK may not expand and isn't tons better than a pistol round. Put a can on and it's as long as a rifle. Again, the Stakeout is harder to miss with. The Glock PDW is less likely to make you deaf and over penetrate to kill your neighbor.

    I see the RMR pistol as covering 99% of my potential issues. The Glock PDW is a great addition. Poke a folding PDW brace into your backpack if you want a more stable platform for proactively delivering death to a bad guy. It won't freak people out if accidentally discovered, is about as quick to proactively deploy as an AR pistol and is considerably lighter.

    After that, get a Stakeout and a full-size shotgun. Then get yourself an AR pistol or three because they are extraordinarily cool and can do about anything a carbine can do within a couple of hundred yards.

    But as an EDC backpack gun? Nah.
    Last edited by DogDoc; 05-20-2019 at 07:40 PM.
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  4. #14
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    While we are on this topic I have a general question about getting supersonic and subsonic loads to work in the same 300 blackout AR pistol. The gas pressure should be different between a 125 supersonic load versus a subsonic 200 grain plus bullet. I see that valved bolt carriers are available so that in over gassed conditions one can vent excess gas tube gas through the bolt. i wonder if such a set up could be tuned so that both loadings of the 300 black out can be used in the same pistol.
    It would seem that a 220 grain bullet at 900 fps if frangible would not have such great penetration and not blow you hearing out so much in confined quarters. i am just speculating at this point and I am making arrangements to get an AR pistol.
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  5. #15
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    I have both a 10.5" 5.56 and 8.5" 300BO with the LAW folder on them and thus are backpackable and sometimes are for car use, NOT being carried. 62 grain Gold Dot for the 5.56 especially counting for the loss in velocity with short barrel, for the 300 I use 110 Barnes for serious use, Lehigh expanding subs for sneaky work. Suppressor helps both but adds length. I also have a Stakeout and a Glock PDW, both are more applicable for most situations. Don't go less than 10.5" on a 5.56 AR, 11.5" if you can help it. 220 BO sub has higher sectional density, so it will penetrate more and tumble.
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by psalms23dad View Post
    The 5.56 was designed for a 20 inch barrel.
    The .300? A 9 inch barrel.

    If short is the goal I only see one option.
    The 300 black out will work well in a nine inch barrel, but I am not sure it was so specifically designed to do. It is the non-trademarked version of the 300 whisper that was intended to be fired with subsonic heavy bullets that I think went through a carbine length barrel. Turns out it works real well through pistol length barrels also due to the lower powder capacity and the very strong AR locked breech system that can handle higher pressures.
    https://sskindustries.com/300-whisper/
    Whispers®: A wide range of calibers encompass the ‘Whisper®’ series of cartridges. A “Whisper®” cartridge must be capable of sub-sonic extreme accuracy with very heavy bullets for its caliber; i.e. 240 grains in 30, as well as moderate to high velocity while maintaining excellent accuracy with light bullets for the caliber; i.e. 125 at 2300 FPS in 30. The 300 Whisper® was the first of the series, and, contrary to what you may have read about it, the fact of the matter is the cartridge was designed as a multi-purpose cartridge from the beginning. Its design parameters, in addition to the ballistics quoted above, were that it must be capable of being used in the AR-15/M-16 family of rifles, Contenders and bolt action rifles as well as being easily suppressed. I know that because I invented it. It revolutionized the tactical suppressed sub-sonic field in controllability in full auto, power and accuracy. It has been very successful and has gained wide acceptance as a hunting round for mid-size game, such as deer, and has probably taken a wider variety of game than any other handgun cartridge in the same time span. Due to its small case capacity, its recoil is very mild.
    One who hammers his gun into a plow plows for those who do not....Unknown
    ...at the end of the day its not about anything else but YOU AND YOURS..... Gabe Suarez
    ....WANT not NEED is what America is all about. ..... Gabe Suarez
    Its not about how fast you can load, but about how well you can shoot ..... Someone being saved by a speed load is not something that has happened with any regularity. Gabe Suarez

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnetmill View Post
    While we are on this topic I have a general question about getting supersonic and subsonic loads to work in the same 300 blackout AR pistol. The gas pressure should be different between a 125 supersonic load versus a subsonic 200 grain plus bullet. I see that valved bolt carriers are available so that in over gassed conditions one can vent excess gas tube gas through the bolt. i wonder if such a set up could be tuned so that both loadings of the 300 black out can be used in the same pistol.
    It would seem that a 220 grain bullet at 900 fps if frangible would not have such great penetration and not blow you hearing out so much in confined quarters. i am just speculating at this point and I am making arrangements to get an AR pistol.
    My 300BO has all standard parts aside from the barrel. It cycles subs and supers with a can, supers without, and I don't recall about the subs without (why, lol?). I hear of problems all the time, but perhaps mine is pleasantly abnormally reliable.
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brightlightman View Post
    I have both a 10.5" 5.56 and 8.5" 300BO with the LAW folder on them and thus are backpackable and sometimes are for car use, NOT being carried. 62 grain Gold Dot for the 5.56 especially counting for the loss in velocity with short barrel, for the 300 I use 110 Barnes for serious use, Lehigh expanding subs for sneaky work. Suppressor helps both but adds length. I also have a Stakeout and a Glock PDW, both are more applicable for most situations. Don't go less than 10.5" on a 5.56 AR, 11.5" if you can help it. 220 BO sub has higher sectional density, so it will penetrate more and tumble.
    Has this been tested about the 220 BO penetrating more. I suspect that they will tumble also. To me this is important information.
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    ...at the end of the day its not about anything else but YOU AND YOURS..... Gabe Suarez
    ....WANT not NEED is what America is all about. ..... Gabe Suarez
    Its not about how fast you can load, but about how well you can shoot ..... Someone being saved by a speed load is not something that has happened with any regularity. Gabe Suarez

  9. #19
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    Its not a big deal to get subs and supers to run in the same gun any more. I have an 8" and a 16" that cycle them both just fine with standard gas blocks. Its also worth noting that there is only about 200 fps difference between an 8" and a 16" barrel. .300 blk is very efficent. There are also more options for expanding sub sonic ammo now. I recently saw a 194 gn, from hornady I think, round on the shelf at a local store. If you hand load there are a lot more options and there are some specialty options for ammo online too.
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  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorkface View Post
    Its not a big deal to get subs and supers to run in the same gun any more. I have an 8" and a 16" that cycle them both just fine with standard gas blocks. Its also worth noting that there is only about 200 fps difference between an 8" and a 16" barrel. .300 blk is very efficent. There are also more options for expanding sub sonic ammo now. I recently saw a 194 gn, from hornady I think, round on the shelf at a local store. If you hand load there are a lot more options and there are some specialty options for ammo online too.
    SSK always advertised slightly higher velocities for the their 300 whisper loadings that were a hundred fps or so more and I think it was due to using longer barrels than pistol length.
    If a pistol 300 blackout will run all of these loads, you can match load to the task at hand. I will not be using a suppressor since I plan on staying away from NFA regulations and other hassles.
    I will likely make my own lowers. It is cheaper to buy fully machined 100% lowers from a local FFL dealer rather than to make them so one actually loses money using the 80% route unless you make a enough to recover the costs of the tooling plus considering time expended. i will likely buy a 100% pistol lower to keep on hand so to play it safe for when state or federal laws start demanding that serial numbers are needed.
    One who hammers his gun into a plow plows for those who do not....Unknown
    ...at the end of the day its not about anything else but YOU AND YOURS..... Gabe Suarez
    ....WANT not NEED is what America is all about. ..... Gabe Suarez
    Its not about how fast you can load, but about how well you can shoot ..... Someone being saved by a speed load is not something that has happened with any regularity. Gabe Suarez

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