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Thread: Red Flag Law

  1. #1
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    Default Red Flag Law

    Red flag laws (Extreme Risk Protection Orders) are, unfortunately, spreading accross the nation. According to a USA Today article (https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ns/3521491002/) 15 states, and Washington D.C., have said "yes", while another 21 have taken at least some steps toward adopting a so-called red flag law.

    Many would agree, that with certain evidences, and/or witnessed behaviors, certain actions would be appropriate.

    After watching the following video, I am not convinced that the actions by the LEO were appropriate. Other than not keeping his hands raised, as instructed by LEO, I did not see evidence that this man intended violence.

    Based on the statements of one person, and nothing else, the individual gets the following:

    Loss of freedom
    Loss of legally owned firearms
    Inability to buy firearms
    Inability to buy ammo
    Possible job loss (who wants to work next to the nut job who was arrested and featured on the news?)
    Has to hire a lawyer to try to get his freedom, property, and property rights back. This may take a while.
    If he still has a job, he will have to take time off to go to court. Possibly (likely) several times.

    How much money, time, and suffering, will this cost this man?

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  2. #2
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    AND? What exactly are you going to do?
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  3. #3
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    I don't think red flag laws are explicitly a bad idea. The problem as I see it is a single vindictive person is all it takes to instigate action. If someone is really a threat far more people in their lives are going to see warnings than just one. We hear it time and time again after a shooting how everyone saw warning signs. If someone is really a threat it should take a minimum of 3-5 people collectively going to the cops to initiate a suspension of their 2nd Amendment rights.


    "If you find yourself in a fair fight you failed to properly prepare..."

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Suarez View Post
    AND? What exactly are you going to do?
    Living in a Red Flag state...thats where I am...ive volunteered my heart out for NRA doing door walks and phone banks and teaching new shooters. Thats all I can do. Wringing my hands and worrying wont change the situation. Instead I will study the moves for BJJ class tonight.

  5. #5
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    The issue of one individual being able to initiate such actions are of course of concern, however should anyone be vindictively accused then it is important to understand what legal steps you could take. Your lawyer should immediately contact a recognised Threat Assessment Professional as a subject matter expert to conduct an independant assessment, much as a specialist consultant would be contacted for a medical condition.
    The field of threat assessment and management has developed extensively over the last couple of decades especially in the US in the FBI, many larger PDs and a number of civilian consultancys. Initial point of contact for anyone with concerns would be ATAP (Association of Threat Assessment Professionals) https://www.atapworldwide.org/
    ...If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
    To serve your turn long after they are gone,
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    Except the Will which says to them: "Hold on!"...
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  6. #6
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    My state just passed a Red Flag law. Many police organizations are saying they won't enforce them since it puts their officers at risk. The congressman who initiated the bill may be coming up for a recall vote.

    My whole thing when I talk about it with people who struggle with critical thinking is:

    If someone is such a threat that they're getting their door kicked in and their guns taken, why are they still out walking around? Imagine this: A guy tells everyone that he's going to lock his family in the car and drive it off a bridge. He fantasizes about it, makes threats about it on social media. He's obsessed with the idea of driving his family off a bridge. His wife and kids live in fear. She goes to a judge. The answer is that they come impound his car.

    Stupid, right?
    ===========================
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  7. #7
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    On the point of “it only takes one person to have your guns taken”; This has always been possible with protective orders/ restraining orders.

    I met someone who did it after a breakup explicitly because she knew he wouldn’t be able to hunt anymore. It took him a year and a few thousand dollars to clear his name.

    I agree that they are not the best. It is however better than wide, sweeping gun control laws. Slippery slope, I know.
    "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act, but a habit." -Aristotle

  8. #8
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    Simple solutions...except of course for those that simply need something to worry about.

    Have your gear stored in various places and tell nobody about it at all. Done and staying done...except for those who just need something to do with their time.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    105
    Couple red flag laws with John Doe investigations if you really want to see how bad things could get before they get better.

    Do what you’ve got to do.

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