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  1. #1
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    Default Does the Army want SMGs???

    OMG.... I saw this and just smiled

    BACK TO SUBGUNS? US Army Releases RFI for Sub Compact Weapons
    http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...kly+Newsletter


    The US Army’s PEO Soldier – Project Manager Soldier Weapons has issued an Request for Information (RFI) to obtain industry feedback on possible submissions to Sub Compact Weapons (SCW) evaluations. The specification details offered by the Project Manager Soldier Weapons (PMSW) are scant and extremely broad. Describing potential SCWs as being select fire weapons, chambered in 9x19mm and having MIL-STD 1913 rail (Picatinny Rail) space.
    The RFI, published 2 May, makes no mention of physical dimensions such as size or weight and instead seeks to cast as wide a net as possible for potential submissions. It does, however, call for suppressors, spares and slings for the weapon (not holsters). Potential future SCW submissions will have to chamber ‘9×19 mm military grade’ ammunition – meaning both M882 ball and the new XM1153 Special Purpose 9mm Round from Winchester.


    Interestingly, ambidextrous controls are not an initial requirement and there is no mention of a folding stock. The 9x19mm requirement is likely to avoid the addition of a new ammunition type into the logistics chain, however, 9mm is unable to defeat even light body armour. The move leaves behind the former interest in small-calibre, high-velocity rounds, capable of defeating some body armour, such as FN’s 5.7×28mm and HK’s 4.6×30mm popular in the late 90s and 2000s.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by EDELWEISS View Post
    OMG.... I saw this and just smiled

    BACK TO SUBGUNS? US Army Releases RFI for Sub Compact Weapons
    http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...kly+Newsletter


    The US Army’s PEO Soldier – Project Manager Soldier Weapons has issued an Request for Information (RFI) to obtain industry feedback on possible submissions to Sub Compact Weapons (SCW) evaluations. The specification details offered by the Project Manager Soldier Weapons (PMSW) are scant and extremely broad. Describing potential SCWs as being select fire weapons, chambered in 9x19mm and having MIL-STD 1913 rail (Picatinny Rail) space.
    The RFI, published 2 May, makes no mention of physical dimensions such as size or weight and instead seeks to cast as wide a net as possible for potential submissions. It does, however, call for suppressors, spares and slings for the weapon (not holsters). Potential future SCW submissions will have to chamber ‘9×19 mm military grade’ ammunition – meaning both M882 ball and the new XM1153 Special Purpose 9mm Round from Winchester.


    Interestingly, ambidextrous controls are not an initial requirement and there is no mention of a folding stock. The 9x19mm requirement is likely to avoid the addition of a new ammunition type into the logistics chain, however, 9mm is unable to defeat even light body armour. The move leaves behind the former interest in small-calibre, high-velocity rounds, capable of defeating some body armour, such as FN’s 5.7×28mm and HK’s 4.6×30mm popular in the late 90s and 2000s.
    If they want to defeat light body armor they might take a hard look at the 7.62x25 with improved projectiles. It is a battle tested round that has been extensively used in many theaters of war.
    If the must stay with the 9x19 parabellum, then they should look into high velocity sabot loads for the 9mm firing a tungsten core.
    One who hammers his gun into a plow plows for those who do not....Unknown
    ...at the end of the day its not about anything else but YOU AND YOURS..... Gabe Suarez
    ....WANT not NEED is what America is all about. ..... Gabe Suarez
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  3. #3
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    Or they could teach guys to shoot people in the face...just saying.
    Gabriel Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  4. #4
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    A new smg - cool!

    Will the winner be truly new, like a Sig MPX? Or, a "renewed" legacy Colt or MP5 system?

    Don't get too excited, though. Many, many years and truckloads of money will be exhausted to get to the end result.
    Lee

    You alone are to be feared. Who can stand before you when you are angry? From Heaven you pronounce your Judgement, and the land feared and was quiet when you, O God, rose up to Judge, to save all the afflicted of the land.

    Psalm 76:7-9

  5. #5
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    We all know there’s room in any multi-faceted force for an SMG. Probably just trying to replace the few, old, complex MP5’s that are still around. I assume this will be a small contract if/ when it drops. A stocked chassis for the 320 or a complete gun that uses the same mags would make sense but that’s unlikely.
    If AP is a major concern they just need to get some short uppers for existing M4 lowers and some of those 4” super rugged suppressors to take the edge off indoors.

    Of course none of this will happen. Just throwing out some thoughts on the matter. I was in from 08 to 15 and saw exactly 6 MP5’s. Three in the arms room at the cool guy firebase we were on in Astan and 3 on a generals PSD at the same location.
    "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act, but a habit." -Aristotle

  6. #6
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    IF it is serious, I do find it interesting that they want to stay with standard 9mm over the PDW rounds (FN 5.7 etc). Staying with 9mm makes sense, especially as the specialty PDW rounds were designed to defeat SOFT body armor and since the world has pretty much moved past soft armor to plates, theres no reason to stick with "boutique" rounds, when plate armor is the new standard. As Gabe says, maybe they should just train for head shots....


    and yeah I'm am excited about any official interest in SMGs....

  7. #7
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    Reads like they are just testing the waters to see what is out there at this point - this is nowhere near the "we need an X to do Y and Z." you'd expect if they were already getting serious about actually buying new SMGs.
    Will be interesting to see where this is going; SMGs seem to be very much a niche weapon today.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bold View Post
    Reads like they are just testing the waters to see what is out there at this point - this is nowhere near the "we need an X to do Y and Z." you'd expect if they were already getting serious about actually buying new SMGs.
    Will be interesting to see where this is going; SMGs seem to be very much a niche weapon today.
    Agreed; but it does sound like they are definitely interested in some version of a SMG, maybe Gabe should suggest a Glock PDW?

  9. #9
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    May 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by EDELWEISS View Post
    Agreed; but it does sound like they are definitely interested in some version of a SMG, maybe Gabe should suggest a Glock PDW?
    While I love the Glock PDW, it is NOT a substitute for a dedicated SMG. It is more of a needs must in order to skirt the NFA. Now it is a great weapons system, I am absolutely not knocking it, a go to war SMG it is not however.
    Greg Nichols- Who you are 5 years from now is directly related to the books you read, who you associate with, and how you spend your free time.

  10. #10
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    Sep 2016
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    I have been drawing up a plan to make a sort of piston/blowback hybrid that can fire extremely over pressure 9mm (think open class guns) all the way down to 147 grain subs with 100% reliability.

    I am on my phone so dont have drawing but try to imagine this and if it already exists (probably doesnt work) let me know:

    Gas port drilled immediately in front of chamber ala hk p7. A piston is pushed back towards the carrier, pushing down a locking mechanism, locking the bolt. Once pressure drops, a spring pushes the pistol bacl forward, raising the locking mechanism and freeing the bolt. Bolt is now essentialy pure blowback operation.

    The idea is, with low pressure ammo, the piston is never pushed back locking the bolt, allowing the gun to cyce normally. High pressure ammo is locked until chamber pressure drops and action can 'unlock' via the piston spring.

    Im gonna build this first on an ar, with proprietary upper, and if that doesnt work, it will look like a mac10 until i give up or it works.

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