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  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2000
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    The Republic of Pirates
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    44,899
    All that said...IF you have trained to NOT overgrip the pistol, you can use a visible laser in conjunction with a set of NVGs - turning the laser on only at the point of firing. That last tactic incidentally is a wise one regardless of IR capability or not. The reason is that you may not be the only one with night vision, and having the IR laser On all the time will tend to act just as a flashlight that is left on, and point everyone back to you. The minimizers will scoff that the beatnik poo-butt thug breaking into your house won't have NV. Maybe not, but I suspect the people here are not of the underachiever class and tend to consider their adversaries as capable enemies, and thus comport themselves accordingly.

    This is what I have been working with for a while now.

    Gabe Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    328
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Suarez View Post
    How does that mount on a Glock?
    Well...Duct tape? I guess I didn't read the part about this only being for handguns only. It was pretty early. Ok, I went back and read the part regarding a bump in the night. So, my post is more of a rifle or shotgun tool.
    Last edited by Steven Spaugh; 11-22-2017 at 11:25 AM.
    And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

    Steven Spaugh

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    NWFL
    Posts
    12,561
    Quote Originally Posted by Steven Spaugh View Post
    Well...Duct tape? I guess I didn't read the part about this only being for handguns only. It was pretty early. Ok, I went back and read the part regarding a bump in the night. So, my post is more of a rifle or shotgun tool.
    For me your post was good information and so was the response by Gabe.
    One who hammers his gun into a plow plows for those who do not....Unknown
    ...at the end of the day its not about anything else but YOU AND YOURS..... Gabe Suarez
    ....WANT not NEED is what America is all about. ..... Gabe Suarez
    Its not about how fast you can load, but about how well you can shoot ..... Someone being saved by a speed load is not something that has happened with any regularity. Gabe Suarez

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    718
    I think I heard a wise gun trainer on a DVD say something about assume your opponent is a Delta guy gone bad....

    For Thermal, I have a Pulsar model. I can pickup rabbits out to 200 and dear at 300 with it. It eats batteries and has a frustrating long boot up time. It also "recalibrates" frequently which means you lose 2/3 seconds while it does its thing.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    328
    Quote Originally Posted by barnetmill View Post
    For me your post was good information and so was the response by Gabe.
    Nobody wants to be the guy that got it wrong, or the guy that disagrees with partial information. Gabe mentioned the door being kicked in, and for me that calls for a shotgun or rifle. However, he was talking primarily about a handgun.

    Gabe's question did make me laugh.
    Last edited by Steven Spaugh; 11-22-2017 at 04:00 PM.
    And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

    Steven Spaugh

  6. #16
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    8,925
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Suarez View Post
    All that said...IF you have trained to NOT overgrip the pistol, you can use a visible laser in conjunction with a set of NVGs - turning the laser on only at the point of firing. That last tactic incidentally is a wise one regardless of IR capability or not. The reason is that you may not be the only one with night vision, and having the IR laser On all the time will tend to act just as a flashlight that is left on, and point everyone back to you. The minimizers will scoff that the beatnik poo-butt thug breaking into your house won't have NV. Maybe not, but I suspect the people here are not of the underachiever class and tend to consider their adversaries as capable enemies, and thus comport themselves accordingly.

    This is what I have been working with for a while now.

    Have you run that on your Glock PDW?
    LIVING > FIRED > JAIL > DEAD

    DISCIPLINA EST LIBERTATEM
    KRG, HRO: Team Tactics 1/2, CRG, HRO: CQB/Team Tactics, Defensive Knife, TMCO


    T
    WOTU Since 2012


  7. #17
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    The Republic of Pirates
    Posts
    44,899
    The Glock PEW is not carried daily in a holster. It is a dedicated unit with a Surefire X400 on it along with a can.
    Gabe Suarez

    Turning Lambs into Lions Since 1995

    Suarez International USA Headquarters

  8. #18
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    The Once Free State
    Posts
    12,377
    Ive worked with Gen 1, 2, and 3 Night Vision. Clearly Gen 3 is the BEST; but at the time I was using Gen 1s and 2s, the Gen 3s were all but vapor to us "regular" guys. Back then I was happy to have Gen 2 stuff, hell I was even happy to have older Gen Zero stuff with a IR spotlight (because the likilyhood of the other guys having any NV was virtually non existent--not so any longer). Now Gen 3 is the goal; but I'm also intrigued by Thermal. NV and Thermal are separate solutions to the same problem. Each works in its own way and each has its own drawbacks.

    There are pros and cons of head mounts, handhelds, and weapons mounted systems. Perhaps we could further discuss those with an emphasis for use by individuals.

    We might also want to discuss use of NV in Urban, Suburban, and Rural settings, as the amount natural and manmade lighting varies greatly in each of those settings. When I lived "just outside" Baltimore City NV wasn't a major necessity, even when I worked the night shift as a cop BUT when I moved and (patrolled) further away from the city lights with a lamppost on every corner, the need for NV became more important. Just as important was the need for multiple flashlights. (It didn't happen to me but I was working when a suspect was able to bolt into the dark and was lost, when the battery on an officers flashlight suddenly failed--no dimming to yellow just on one second then dead). Now that I'm much more suburban and retired, NV is even more important to me. I no longer have a radio with a Signal 13 button. My Back Up is my wife and only then after she and the kids are armed and secure.

    Hunting Wild Boar is a passion. I spend as much time in the field at night as during daylight. NV is again on my want list...

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Southeast Florida
    Posts
    1,534
    Affordable and very good image quality thermal that can be head mounted is coming soon from FLIR.

    The latest and greatest PVS-14 is unfilmed white phosphorus, I believe.

    I suspect digital large pixel CMOS technology will soon replace the Gen 3 analog technology, but I'm not sure how soon.

    The ultimate is called fusion--overlays thermal on top of NV. Right now it's still expensive, but I'm sure that will improve.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    252
    Both I2 and thermal have advanced greatly in the last 5 years. Resolution and tube life, light amplification, fusion or overlay of a thermal picture, image intensifiers and their accessories are essential equipment for the modern warrior. With IR pointers being available to anyone, the main obstacle to most is cost. A complete tier one setup of monocular, bump helmet, ir pointer/illuminator is going to run about 5-6K. Add first line thermal and you are adding another 4-7K. One can certainly buy lesser quality gear and still be far ahead of opponents that have nothing, but is that really where we want to go?

    Current monocular units can be handheld, weapon mounted, head mounted, or connected to various cameras. Binocular units give much better depth of field and visual fields for head mounted operations (the GPNVG-18 quad unit is AMAZING), but the price starts to go up exponentially and the versatility goes down. Weapon sights are another whole topic, with a large number of options available.

    Currently, my 'standard' advice is to get a PVS-14 with the desired tube, a Norotos or Wilcox mount on a bump helmet (or ballistic if required), with a DBAL or other appropriate IR laser unit for the application. Once can add thermal with a COTI to provide a thermal overlay, or go to a dedicated thermal unit like the IR Defense (now Trijicon) IR Patrol systems.

    Weapon sights would seem to be best served by the various clip-on units, give the versatility. I'm using the CNVD-LR, PVS-26 and PVS-27 with excellent results out to as much as 1200 yards with the right illuminator.

    All available systems have various advantages depending on the mission profile. Unless you have unlimited funding available, budget usually drives the ultimate decision, trying to get the most versatility at the best price point. There is a reason the PVS-14 is the goto unit for the majority.
    Cory Trapp
    Gunsite Academy, Inc.

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