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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Exiled in Texas
    Posts
    7,508
    Don't buy defensive ammo that is so expensive that you won't ever shoot it. Both DPX and HST can be found in 50-rd boxes that make them more affordable than they otherwise might be. You'll do the bulk of your shooting with cheap target ammo, and you can try to find ammo that roughly tracks with your man-eater ammo. But keep enough of the good stuff around that on those occasions at the range where you want to take a really distant, accurate shot, you can just pop in a mag of the good stuff and not sweat the cost.

    This ammo also needs to be available. If you found a deal on Black Talons twenty years ago, and you are now down to your last few boxes, your training will suffer for your unwillingness to occasionally practice with the good stuff.
    Virtute et Armis

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    1,085
    Quote Originally Posted by Custom II View Post
    This!

    I use Federal 124 grain HST, and also have some hydra shocks in the same weight. This ammo is accurate, and much hotter than your average plinking 9mm.

    Now that I'm trying to get into the suppressor game, I well may start stacking the 147 grain HST variant in bulk.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    For years I carried hydra shocks starting because of the near "ball ammo" shape so they were reliable in my BHP. Read a lot of yada yada about clogging and not opening. Before the site was consolidated there was data on the in the sub forum that multiple shots came back listed as " not recovered" so didn't open, over penetrated and was not able to be found. Since the man doing the testing seemed to be in very high esteem I took his testing to be right and went to DPX. Now the federals are in me bowl full of random HPs that I grap a fist full of to test new pistols for feeding HP.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Inland NW
    Posts
    2,161
    Quote Originally Posted by Travlin View Post
    For years I carried hydra shocks starting because of the near "ball ammo" shape so they were reliable in my BHP. Read a lot of yada yada about clogging and not opening. Before the site was consolidated there was data on the in the sub forum that multiple shots came back listed as " not recovered" so didn't open, over penetrated and was not able to be found. Since the man doing the testing seemed to be in very high esteem I took his testing to be right and went to DPX. Now the federals are in me bowl full of random HPs that I grap a fist full of to test new pistols for feeding HP.
    Interesting.

    While they are my second line ammo, that makes me curious. Although, at the end of the day, I want accuracy. Expansion is a nice bonus.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Ο τολμών νικά

    How can you profit from the status quo, instead of complaining about it?

    7.62x51, 5.56x45, .45acp, 9x19, .380acp

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    94

    Default 9MM Service Ammo Question

    I've been shooting Winchester white box and shoot/carry Ranger. For me the POI is on with both. Even made 50 yard head size shots yesterday with the white box stuff and a RMR.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    2,401
    I have... A fair amount of carry ammo laying around (when good deals on case lots pop up, it's hard to pass). I do tend to, personally, inventory cases of duty ammo from various manufactures. Reason being: if a recall is initiated on a particular round, i have a fall back. Every coMpany can have a quality lapse (hornady recalled some critical duty, Winchester Ranger Bonded got pulled from ICE for a short period due to a quality issue, etc).

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    1,091
    Quote Originally Posted by Pachucko View Post
    Would your recommendations change with barrel length? No.

    In particular, do you use the same loads in PCCs? Yes--Beretta CX4 and a Hi Point 9MM

    For example, would you worry about a +P load being too fast from a 16" barrel and not getting enough penetration? Too fast in what regard--spin or velocity? Actually, neither is a concern. 9mm ammo is designed for short barrels and does not gain significant velocity from a longer barrel, maybe 100-150 fps. That does affect rotation, but not enough at these velocities to cause a bullet to break apart because of centrifugal force. The fps expansion range is more limited by low velocity non-expansion than by high velocity. At higher velocities, petals on most HP bullets fold back further than normal reducing their frontal area and allowing deep penetration. Higher velocities will often make an HP act more like FMJ.

    Thanks......Pachucko
    CB3
    Lord of harvest, grant that we wholesome grain and pure may be. Hymn, Come Ye Thankful People Come

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Olympia, WA
    Posts
    22
    After chasing "the new hotness" for several years I decided to make things simpler by researching the most current data from testing done by the FBI and other highly respected individual testers. After reading through all the results I chose to go with Speer Gold Dots; 124gr +p in 9mm and 64gr GDSP in .223. Both bullets perform well in their respective calibers and it is generally available if you look hard enough. I am patiently waiting for some of Speer's brand new pistol offering, the G2, to hit the shelves or become available online. From what I can tell the bullet construction remains the same but the hollow cavity is filled with an elastomer "to provide rapid expansion where needed and minimize over penetration where it's not", similar to what Hornady did with their Critical Duty and Critical Defense. So I guess I'm not through chasing " the new hotness". Maybe after the G2.......

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    8,664
    Gabe has mentioned a guy that has killed somewhere around 100 guys will ball 9mm. I wouldn't put too much in the best thing since sliced bread ammo and focus more on your shooting ability and getting most dangerous.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    1,085
    Chad, I'm with you.

    For me it's a thing of over penetration. I want to be able to rely what something like DPX to open and slow down.

    If it was for the boutique thing I'd be carrying G2 RIP, LOL. Man I wouldn't want to explain a fist full of that in court.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Exiled in Texas
    Posts
    7,508
    Quote Originally Posted by Travlin View Post
    Man I wouldn't want to explain a fist full of that in court.
    While I wouldn't want to have to explain the Punisher grips on a client's gun, ammo doesn't worry me. If I had a good supply of Black Talons set aside, I'd still use them. If a bad guy needs to be killed, then kill him with the best ammo. Don't select a sub-par ammo because you think it is more politically palatable.
    Virtute et Armis

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