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  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Johnson City, TN
    Posts
    3,031
    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    Thanks to Alex and JD for running a very polished and informative course. Specifically I appreciated Alex's command and ease of delivery of the material, and JD's quietly assured 1on1 style of instruction obviously born out of real world experience.
    Practice makes perfect

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    It was my first class with SI. I will likely take further classes from this organization.
    Welcome! We are glad you enjoyed yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    I am already an experienced shooter and instructor so the first day felt a little slow as it was mostly a refresher of the fundamentals. I acknowledge the necessity of this since the instructors dont know us or our level so to keep things safe they need to make sure everyone is at a certain level before getting to the more involved shooting drills.
    Exactly. I think that I heard you say that you are an IDPA Expert. I'd say that Marksman is the more commonly encountered level in the general student population, so that puts you way out in the tail end of the bell curve, so to speak.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    That being said I did find the lecture on PESTS EAT FAST useful as well as their clearly presented ideas concerning point shooting.
    Excellent! Like we said in class: once you learn the basics, you may only get a few things from each class, but they are entirely worth it.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    The second day involved more shooting than the first which I and my G21 thoroughly enjoyed. I also found the SI method of after action valuable.
    Excellent.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    If I had to find anything to quibble with it would be: 1. the course is billed as "not for beginners", but the first day was spent fully on the fundamentals.
    If I recall correctly, part of the morning was reviewing the fundamentals. The rest of the morning was setting the stage for the class. After lunch was all new (compared to CRG1) material: drawing from cover, point shooting (which some students found freaking amazing), and teaching everyone to get off the X, safely.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    I would have liked to see more advanced stuff right off the bat. (like i said above i understand why they did it this way, but maybe SI could advertise this as a beginner to medium lvl course?)
    On the SI site, it says "THIS COURSE IS NOT FOR THE NOVICE SHOOTER" I'd say that is correct. Complete novices should first take CRG1. CRG2 is the next logical step, but by that time they need to have a firm grasp of the fundamentals, draw and safety, or they will not get the most out of the class, and potentially endanger their fellow students.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    and 2. I really only had a problem with one SI item of doctrine. magazine retention. you'll never convince me to retain an empty mag during an emergency reload. it is just a fact that doing a competition style slide lock reload is faster than a reload with retention and we all know that speed kills.
    Agreed!

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    I truly believe that a tac/retention reload is only appropriate if you have A: time, and B: cover. Time being the most important.
    Agreed!

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    I will ofcourse choose to retain all equipment if im not getting shot at...(but even in training i will drop an empty mag on slide lock so i dont develop a bad habit)
    You are correct in thinking that we want to do "the right thing" the majority of the time, because under stress we will probably revert to doing that.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    Alex, JD please correct me if I'm wrong that SI teaches to retain in emergency reload. If i miss understood i appologize, but thats what came across during the course.
    I had made a mental note to review that point once we got everyone together again, to make sure everyone fully understood what we were saying, but something else came up, so I did not. Let me do this now.....

    My good friend and retired SI Staff Instructor Chris Upchurch coined the term "overridable default" for what we teach. As the "overridable default", we teach the following in case of a slide lock / emergency reload or proactive reload:
    1. Finger off the trigger, move pistol to work space.
    2. Activate magazine release using shooting hand
    3. Yank out magazine using support hand
    4. Stow magazine in pocket (or belt if that makes more sense for your gear setup)
    5. Access magazine in magazine pouch. Tip of finger almost on tip of bullet.
    6. Flat to flat, accelerate it in.
    7. Run the slide using four fingers and the palm of your hand, vigorously.

    The "overridable" part of "overridable default" comes from the fact that if our lizard brain is screaming at us that we don't have time to stow the magazine, we skip step 4. Retaining any magazine (empty or partially loaded) is not worth getting shot. However, by making the whole thing (including stowing the mag) our default (i.e., most practiced option), it is more likely that we will do the right thing when the time comes, because skipping a step from a well-rehearsed routine is easier than adding a seldom-practiced step under pressure.

    Yanking out the mag and retaining it as our default option turn out to have some other - unexpected - benefits:
    1. Step #3 guarantees that we make a hole for the new mag before we try inserting the new mag. Arriving at step 6 with the old mag still firmly seated is NOT good for your OODA loop.
    2. A "muffler pipe" failure to extract can mimic a slide-lock situation, because the slide is partially to the rear. If our lizard brain misidentifies this as a slide-lock situation, we still successfully clear it, as long as we flip the gun on the rack part. By retaining the mag as a default we save the ammo in the mag, even if we misidentified it. I've had that happen myself. By the time I took out the mag, and it was heavier than usual, my lizard brain realized something was wrong. By the time I got to step 6, my lizard brain had figured out what was going on, and automatically put in the flip with the rack.
    3. A double feed can also mimic a slide-lock situation, because the slide is partially to the rear. If our lizard brain misidentifies this as a slide-lock situation, we still successfully clear it, for most guns, using the steps above. Trying to drop the mag without yanking it out is never going to work in the case of a double feed. Once again, by retaining the mag as a default we save the ammo in the mag, even if we misidentify it.
    4. Pushing up on the slide stop during firing may cause a slide-lock situation, while we still have ammo in the gun. By retaining the mag as a default we save the ammo in the mag.
    5. Magazines don't get damaged from repeatedly hitting the ground if we are teaching on concrete or rocks, or dirty if we are teaching on sand or mud. While it would be ideal to have a set of training magazines, and another set of magazines to carry, some folks show up for class with the only 3 magazines they own, and will need fully functional equipment for the trip home after the range.

    While we try to avoid decision points as much as possible (due to Hick's law), when I'm shooting scenarios, my lizard brain has no problems deciding what to do. Sometimes I retain, sometimes I don't. It just depends on the availability of time and cover, as you pointed out. While I was thinking about this now, it occurred to me that it might be clearer to use two terms: slide-lock reload and emergency reload. Slide lock reload means we have time and/or cover, thus retaining the magazine. Emergency reload means we have an emergency situation on our hands, and need to get back into the fight RIGHT NOW!, thus making the conscious decision to discard the mag rather than stowing it, or better yet: we draw our other gun (New York reload), and get back to work. If the distance is close enough, we may forego the reload altogether, and go hands-on before drawing our other gun, or move the non-functioning gun to our support hand for use as an impact weapon and go to knife with our shooting hand. It all depends on the situation, and the more we practice, the better our decisions will be under pressure.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigT5g View Post
    Over all I highly recommend training with SI from what I have seen so far. I hope to attend the team tactics course in June schedule allowing.
    Excellent! JD and I are looking forward to seeing you there. Thank you for posting your review, and the opportunity to let me pontificate on the mag retention issue.
    Last edited by Alex Nieuwland; 05-28-2014 at 08:56 PM.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Johnson City, TN
    Posts
    3,031
    Quote Originally Posted by Eldora View Post
    "Was it Remington Golden Bullet?" Yes, Alex, it was Golden Bullet. When we began you suggested I clean the little Ruger a couple of times during the day. I didn't and that night in the motel when I stripped it down it wasn't dirty at all. Smith & Wesson sells a branded dry lube that I like. It sprays on wet, then evaporates with no greasy film. A shot of that kept it going throughout the class. I did clean it Monday morning at home but it really wasn't needed.

    That's impressive. I'll remember that. My most-frequently used .22 ammo (CCI Mini-Mag) has so much grease on the bullet that problems are almost guaranteed after about 100 rounds, or less. I took my Advantage Arms .22 conversion kit for my Glock 19 to a Steel Challenge match two weekends ago, and had a malfunction on the third stage, after only about 60 rounds fired.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldora View Post
    Since BigT5g mentioned it, I'd like to second his comments and compliment you on your manner of speech and command of the range. Clear enunciation and flawless grammar helps to make the course of study easier to understand. As someone who would rather write than speak, I noticed that quality immediately. Clearly explaining the reasoning behind SI methods helps, too.


    We try. Please see the post above for the background on retaining the mags vs not retaining them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldora View Post
    On a different note; I had the idea to hang an old shirt on a hanger from a low tree branch in the backyard and use it for Airsoft practice. I also put an old cookie sheet inside the shirt for a little "ping"; kinda like shooting steel. I can move to my heart's content in any angle I want. It's easy to simulate cover and just about anything else one might need to practice. Spent a few minutes out there this evening with the pistol. Works pretty well, thank you!
    That is a good idea! I'll try that myself.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Columbia, MD
    Posts
    6
    JD, Alex,
    Thanks for your replies. Well thought out and expressed as always. Alex your "pontification" on the mag retention issue has cleared things up for me. "overridable default" makes perfect sense to me, and I see the benefits of the system concerning malfunctions. I like the idea of differentiating between "slidelock" and "emergency" reloads. Now I feel like we are on the same page.
    Hopefully I can make the intro to team tactics in June. Ill be down in NC for the Carolina Cup IDPA match on the 19th anyway. i just need to find something to do on the 20th and 21st to make it worth while to stay down there for the course on the 22nd.
    NRA Certified Instructor/R.S.O
    MD State Police Qualified Handgun Instructor
    IDPA Classified Expert in Stock Service Pistol
    M16/AR15 Certified Armorer
    Israeli method civilian active shooter response instructor
    Co Founder/Instructor - Dynamic Defense Concepts LLC

  4. #14
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Columbia, MD
    Posts
    6
    Oh and I second the praise for the Ruger SR22. I have this pistol also and find it utterly reliable and very clean shooting. not as accurate as a Mark II or browning buckmark etc, but its a great little trainer/fun gun.
    NRA Certified Instructor/R.S.O
    MD State Police Qualified Handgun Instructor
    IDPA Classified Expert in Stock Service Pistol
    M16/AR15 Certified Armorer
    Israeli method civilian active shooter response instructor
    Co Founder/Instructor - Dynamic Defense Concepts LLC

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    249
    Hate I missed it guys. Sounds like another great class. Just couldn't get the crew together and I was tied up getting our new heat treat furnace in for the shop. JD the crew should all be down for the team class though. Alex hope you'll be in to. Always good to train with you both.
    on the SR22 they are great little pistols, we sell tons of parts for them and unlike the p22 I don't have a steady stream of them coming in to get them reliable.
    -eric
    And whatever you do, whether in word or deed do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him. Colossians 3:17
    -SI classes: CRG, Defensive pistol, PSP, Rifle, Advanced Rifle, Shotgun, FOF, Vehicle gunfighting
    -Certified Glock, Sig, FN, Xd/XDM AR/Ak, CZ

    -Originally Posted by Gabe Suarez
    And alcohol is just to get you drunk
    women are just to relieve the pressure
    and food is just to kill the hunger.....
    Hardly the sort of life I care to live.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Johnson City, TN
    Posts
    3,031
    Quote Originally Posted by egalloway View Post
    JD the crew should all be down for the team class though. Alex hope you'll be in to. Always good to train with you both.
    Excellent! I'm already looking forward to being there. Earlier today, I ordered some more hate gear at OST, and was assured it would get to me in time for the class. The Sneakybag concept has worked well for me in the past, and would probably do just fine for this class as well, but this class was the perfect excuse to start setting up my war belt.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    249
    You'll dig the war belt. I've sorted mine out a bit, added to taken away etc. ran it in Randy's shotgun a month or so back. Looking forward to running it in the team class. See you all soon.
    And whatever you do, whether in word or deed do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him. Colossians 3:17
    -SI classes: CRG, Defensive pistol, PSP, Rifle, Advanced Rifle, Shotgun, FOF, Vehicle gunfighting
    -Certified Glock, Sig, FN, Xd/XDM AR/Ak, CZ

    -Originally Posted by Gabe Suarez
    And alcohol is just to get you drunk
    women are just to relieve the pressure
    and food is just to kill the hunger.....
    Hardly the sort of life I care to live.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Posts
    632
    Alex and JD, I plan on signing up for this team tactics class, but want to make sure I am set on equipment first. I plan on using my FS 2000 with TIB bag and my G17 in appendix. Is appendix carry OK? Or do I need an OWB setup. Thanks
    Suarez International Student since 2013

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    515
    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot62 View Post
    Alex and JD, I plan on signing up for this team tactics class, but want to make sure I am set on equipment first. I plan on using my FS 2000 with TIB bag and my G17 in appendix. Is appendix carry OK? Or do I need an OWB setup. Thanks
    That's how I would run it. And if I know JD and Alex, that's how they will run it also.

    Train like you would fight! That might be my new sign off.

    Sent from my XT1030 using Tapatalk

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    NC for refit
    Posts
    1,622
    Quote Originally Posted by Patriot62 View Post
    Alex and JD, I plan on signing up for this team tactics class, but want to make sure I am set on equipment first. I plan on using my FS 2000 with TIB bag and my G17 in appendix. Is appendix carry OK? Or do I need an OWB setup. Thanks
    The TIB or Sneaky bag is good to go for AIWB.
    Chest rigs and other set ups require an off set and dropped holster or thigh holster.
    I am looking forward to training with all of you again.

    v/r

    JD

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