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View Full Version : RMR and police use?



odin0311
08-24-2011, 08:48 PM
Greetings,

I stumbled across this sight by accident and have scoured every thread in this forum. I am absolutely hooked on the idea of an RMR with BUIS. Are any of you in law enforcement and using an rds pistol as your duty sidearm? Is anyone aware of agencies who have authorized their use? I'd like to gather information and make a presentation to my department. Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Jon Payne
08-24-2011, 09:17 PM
To my knowledge, I am the only peace officer in Orange County TX qualified with a TSD Glock. I am qualified to carry the TSD Glock as a Deputy Constable, but have to carry a Glock 22 (Gabe's converted Glock 31) as a part-time paid patrolman for a different municipal PD. I show cased my TSD Glock to my PD Chief today. He was impressed to say the least, but it is a very small PD and I'm just getting him sold on equipping their Bushmaster M4's (not my 1st choice) with Aimpoint H-1's.

Ryan Acuff
08-24-2011, 09:24 PM
I'll carry one on duty if I can find a Glock 21 slide at a reasonable price.

coastalcop
08-24-2011, 09:28 PM
Currently carry an rmr equipped 35. But I am told that the agency is probably going to go mandatory issue


I should clarify that as mandatory issue of a non rmr glock.

bae4
08-25-2011, 05:01 AM
The RMR could be sold as a liability-reducing and officer safety improving measure.:think:

Basically it could be sold to PDs for the same reasons that the Taser has been widely adopted. ("Why use the billy club when you can zap the perp?")

Photoman
08-25-2011, 08:29 AM
Would love to see the shooting results after running an academy class with RDS pistols v. iron sight pistols.

coastalcop
08-25-2011, 12:14 PM
It would be VERY telling, but like many things in govt. the buy in cost makes beancounters shudder.

I explain it to hunters that are shocked with the (I believe still conventional wisdom) that you should spend at least as much on your glass as your rifle for a decent deer gun. Same for the pistol.

TACC
08-25-2011, 12:19 PM
The logic needed to "sell" the idea never convinces the higher ups, the bottom line is all they see.

Jon Payne
08-25-2011, 12:36 PM
I don't think that is a true statement, if it where we would still be issued wheel guns with 18 rounds of ammo and 870 Shotguns in standard capacity.
The logic needed to "sell" the idea never convinces the higher ups, the bottom line is all they see.

Spiffy
08-25-2011, 12:37 PM
It would be VERY telling, but like many things in govt. the buy in cost makes beancounters shudder.

I explain it to hunters that are shocked with the (I believe still conventional wisdom) that you should spend at least as much on your glass as your rifle for a decent deer gun. Same for the pistol.

Of course your 100% correct. The men who always take multiple deer each year that I know have good glass and good guns. Most however only shoot 3 or 4 times to make sure the scope is still "close" and they don't see too many deer so they don't take to heart why they miss the deer.

Dave Sauer
08-25-2011, 01:03 PM
I'm carrying my RMR equipped M&P on duty. Only one in my agency to my knowledge. I didn't ask if I could, I just did it. I am of the philosophy that if I haven't been told that I can't, then I can. Too many think that "If I haven't been told that I can then I can't." There is huge difference between those two point of view.

odin0311
08-25-2011, 01:14 PM
This would be along the lines of equipping a patrol rifle with an after market cowitnessed sight. Strictly at the officer's expense. With budget cuts and lay offs there is absolutely no way of getting an mrds any other way. It'll also have to be mounted on an officer's personal weapon. We won't be allowed to mill the slides on department equipment.

@ coastalcop- I read on here bladetech males a good holster, any idea on a basketweave holster?

@John payne- what are the hurdles your dealing with in your department to have it approved?*
**

Winchester67
08-25-2011, 01:15 PM
Look, if I was Gabe I would get the RMR Glock to the FBI decision makers. Once they give it the green light, it is just a matter of being on the Gravy Train. Every department in the US would consider it after that endorsement. To me, their endorsement does not matter but Gabe's endorsement got me to open my wallet. I can't help it the world it upside down sometimes, you just have to be smart enough to run your own ship despite all the questionable info out there. If you are at this forum, you know you will find the truth. When my Glock 19 slide gets in, I am going to pitch it to the local PD. They have had Gabe come down to teach before, so they are open to good ideas. Most cops are not "gun guys". If this make qualification scores go up, they will HAVE to buy it!

odin0311
08-25-2011, 02:13 PM
This would be along the lines of equipping a patrol rifle with an after market cowitnessed sight. Strictly at the officer's expense. With budget cuts and lay offs there is absolutely no way of getting an mrds any other way. It'll also have to be mounted on an officer's personal weapon. We won't be allowed to mill the slides on department equipment.

@ coastalcop- I read on here bladetech males a good holster, any idea on a basketweave holster?

@Jon payne- what are the hurdles your dealing with in your department to have it approved?*
**

Jon Payne
08-25-2011, 03:23 PM
The first hurdle is getting them to understand the durability of the product, then the need, third is cost.
This would be along the lines of equipping a patrol rifle with an after market cowitnessed sight. Strictly at the officer's expense. With budget cuts and lay offs there is absolutely no way of getting an mrds any other way. It'll also have to be mounted on an officer's personal weapon. We won't be allowed to mill the slides on department equipment.

@ coastalcop- I read on here bladetech males a good holster, any idea on a basketweave holster?

@Jon payne- what are the hurdles your dealing with in your department to have it approved?*
**

WadeP
08-25-2011, 03:53 PM
Twenty-five years ago, most cops carried revolvers. Fifteen years ago, before the North Hollywood bank robbery shootout, it was very rare to see a patrolman with a rifle. Now, 99.9% of the police carry semi-auto pistols and it's not uncommon to see an AR-15 racked in a patrol car and many of those rifles have some sort of red-dot optic attached.

At least one gun manufacturer now offers a factory pistol with the slide cut for a small red-dot. As demonstrated by TSD, as the size of red-dots come down and reliability goes up, this setup becomes more feasible and transitions from the realm of the game-gun to the reality of practical CCW carry. If the optics can hit a price-point where your average gun buyer won't have sticker shock at the price of a red dot equipped pistol, I think more manufacturers will jump on the bandwagon with factory red-dot setups if they think they can make a buck by distinguishing their pistol from the herd.

After that happends, I don't think it will be too long before a red-dot equipped pistol will be a common sight in uniformed officers' holsters.

I know in our agency, putting a red dot on each and every issued rifle has been a great enhancement.

Gabriel Suarez
08-25-2011, 04:07 PM
In three years, we will see factory hanguns routinely come with these out of the box (of course by then TSD will be into other things).
In five years they will be common on top level operator's guns in all sectors.
In ten years they will be talking about the old days when people used iron sights.

For the patrol guys today, we have the guns and we have the holsters. All you need is the coin, and the nerve.

Photoman
08-25-2011, 07:04 PM
Look, if I was Gabe I would get the RMR Glock to the FBI decision makers. Once they give it the green light, it is just a matter of being on the Gravy Train.


If that happened, Glock would start making them! :shock:

odin0311
08-25-2011, 10:09 PM
This would be along the lines of equipping a patrol rifle with an after market cowitnessed sight. Strictly at the officer's expense. With budget cuts and lay offs there is absolutely no way of getting an mrds on the dept's dime. It'll also have to be mounted on an officer's personal weapon. We won't be allowed to mill the slides on department equipment (like I'd ever want to give it back anyway).

What are the hurdles you are overcoming within your department to use the rmr? I understand the "I'll do it till they tell me I can't" perspective, but my issue is one of getting the policy adapted to allow it.

At a minimum I'll be getting a set up for my off duty, and one for the wife, she told me she wanted one today. I'd really like to get this squared away for a duty gun.

odin0311
08-25-2011, 10:14 PM
And Gabe, I copied the blade tech holster, any chance of a level 3 retention that comes in basketweave? I'm at a department of just under 200, lots that would jump on the bandwagon here. We are a relatively progressive department when it comes to firearms, however admin are far more progressive when somebody else has done the leg work. That FBI pitch is brilliant.

kabar
08-25-2011, 10:29 PM
I saw FN has a new off the shelf RMR equipped model. Times are a changing.

17128
17129

Nanuk
08-26-2011, 04:13 AM
In three years, we will see factory hanguns routinely come with these out of the box (of course by then TSD will be into other things).
In five years they will be common on top level operator's guns in all sectors.
In ten years they will be talking about the old days when people used iron sights.

For the patrol guys today, we have the guns and we have the holsters. All you need is the coin, and the nerve.


Absolutely, ideas and minds in law enforcement change slowly. 10 years ago we were not even allowed to have optics on M-4's now we have a choice on which one.

silversport
08-26-2011, 07:11 AM
Gabe and this website got me interested last Winter about the concept...I purchased one of these...and am quite satisfied...
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b72/silversport1/P1000021_edited-1.jpg

...but then I realized for simplicity's sake why do I keep hearing the answer and then coming to a different conclusion...nothing against my FNP-45 Tactical but...

A short time later I picked up a GLOCK 17 on the cheap because it had the useless 9MM caliber and was beat by the officer carrying it :suspect: ...sent it off to GLOCK for updates and a new frame...then I sent the slide off to Mr. Suarez and and OST...when it returns I will FINALLY have listened and done the right thing...:biglaugh:

Bill

Winchester67
08-28-2011, 10:58 AM
To me, it really is cheating to get on the RMR bandwagon. With lives on the line, especially YOURS, why would you not want every edge available? Red Dots are finally compact and durable enough for everyday carry. To me, it is exactly like 100 years ago when some guys went with the Colt 1911 pistol when most guys were still on the revolver. Gents, this forum exists to distill to the best. The RMR Glock is the best...why are you short changing yourself? Because you want to buy a big screen TV? You already have a TV...spend that money to get the best fighting pistol in history.