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KarlinPhoenix
07-18-2010, 10:43 AM
Very recently declassified 1942 Ranger Training videos.

This one shows some interesting 'knife' fighting techniques. I recommend looking at all of them (they are short)
and see if there is anything useful that you can incorporate into your personal training that will add value to
what you can do, either skills or conditioning.

This is number 8 of 9 vids.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nj3uLDR2qFg&NR=1

A.J. Adams
07-18-2010, 10:49 AM
Cool video! Looks like some point shooting going on with those rifles!

KarlinPhoenix
07-18-2010, 11:00 AM
From the end of the last vid:


"Our soldiers must have the fighting spirit. If you call that
hating our enemies, then we must hate with every fiber
of our being. We must lust for battle--our objective in life
must be to kill.... Since Killing is the object of our efforts,
the sooner we get in the killing mood, the better and
more skillful we shall be when the real test comes."

"The struggle is for survival----KILL or be KILLED."

signed, ----Lt. Gen. Lesley James McNair
Chief of the Army Ground Forces

"We are not going to be Killed!"

denko
07-18-2010, 01:07 PM
That was interesting,thanks.

TennDECA
07-18-2010, 01:14 PM
Interesting stuff. I wonder who the Instructor was?

ACIC5
07-18-2010, 01:46 PM
[quote=KarlinPhoenix;990203]From the end of the last vid:


"Our soldiers must have the fighting spirit. If you call that
hating our enemies, then we must hate with every fiber
of our being. We must lust for battle--our objective in life
must be to kill.... Since Killing is the object of our efforts,
the sooner we get in the killing mood, the better and
more skillful we shall be when the real test comes."

"The struggle is for survival----KILL or be KILLED."

signed, ----Lt. Gen. Lesley James McNair
Chief of the Army Ground Forces

Can you even imagine a General officer in Obama's Army saying something so non PC? Even in WWII fighting generals were few. I wonder if they even exist today.

KarlinPhoenix
07-18-2010, 02:13 PM
[quote=KarlinPhoenix;990203]From the end of the last vid:


"Our soldiers must have the fighting spirit. If you call that
hating our enemies, then we must hate with every fiber
of our being. We must lust for battle--our objective in life
must be to kill.... Since Killing is the object of our efforts,
the sooner we get in the killing mood, the better and
more skillful we shall be when the real test comes."

"The struggle is for survival----KILL or be KILLED."

signed, ----Lt. Gen. Lesley James McNair
Chief of the Army Ground Forces

Can you even imagine a General officer in Obama's Army saying something so non PC? Even in WWII fighting generals were few. I wonder if they even exist today.

I was very pleased to see the highlighted text, above, and posted it here. I do not know of any current General Officers who would speak like this Lt. Gen. Lesley James McNair did in 1942. The business of warriors is killing the enemy and it is important to have the correct mindset to work 'effectively'. The very restrictive and politically-developed ROE tie the hands of our military who are on the 'sharp end' and directly lead to the deaths of American warriors.

SUA SPONTE
07-18-2010, 03:00 PM
Good find Karl!!


RLTW
T.

SUA SPONTE
07-18-2010, 03:17 PM
Any commander today would pop a vein in his head if I turned in a "risk assessment" that had us running the "O" course with fixed bayonettes.....I may just have to do that.:D

Cheers
T.

KarlinPhoenix
07-18-2010, 07:42 PM
Any commander today would pop a vein in his head if I turned in a "risk assessment" that had us running the "O" course with fixed bayonettes.....I may just have to do that.:D

Cheers
T.

I noticed those M1903 rifles had 'live' blades fixed. I like the realism and trust (from the chain-of-command) to run the trainees with combat equipment. In other vids in this series, flame-throwers are 'fired' over the trainees; what fun training this was.

RLTW,

Karl in Phoenix

ArticPara
07-18-2010, 07:58 PM
I noticed those M1903 rifles had 'live' blades fixed. I like the realism and trust (from the chain-of-command) to run the trainees with combat equipment. In other vids in this series, flame-throwers are 'fired' over the trainees; what fun training this was.

RLTW,

Karl in Phoenix

Realistic alright... I noticed in the first vid the class had a few hundred candidates and by the last vid there was 30-40 left. This early in the war they were probably the cadre training-up for the 6th Bat.

MTS
07-18-2010, 08:25 PM
Realistic alright... I noticed in the first vid the class had a few hundred candidates and by the last vid there was 30-40 left. This early in the war they were probably the cadre training-up for the 6th Bat.

Actually that school was not a training school for 6TH Ranger Battalion but a school to teach Ranger skills to various military personnel. That is why there were USN personnel taking the course. In addition in some scenes there were "Colored" (to use the term in use at the time) troops training. There weren't any "Colored" Ranger units until 2ND Ranger CO (Airborne) was stood up in Korea during the war there.

The school was commanded by LT COL Henry Mucci who later was made commander of 98TH Field Artillery Battalion and tasked with converting it into a Ranger Battalion which he did and the unit was designated 6TH Ranger Battalion.

ArticPara
07-18-2010, 08:52 PM
Actually that school was not a training school for 6TH Ranger Battalion but a school to teach Ranger skills to various military personnel. That is why there were USN personnel taking the course. In addition in some scenes there were "Colored" (to use the term in use at the time) troops training. There weren't any "Colored" Ranger units until 2ND Ranger CO (Airborne) was stood up in Korea during the war there.

The school was commanded by LT COL Henry Mucci who later was made commander of 98TH Field Artillery Battalion and tasked with converting it into a Ranger Battalion which he did and the unit was designated 6TH Ranger Battalion.

Thanks for the insight. I did notice the navy denims, perhaps a cohort of navy frogmen.

KarlinPhoenix
07-18-2010, 10:26 PM
Actually that school was not a training school for 6TH Ranger Battalion but a school to teach Ranger skills to various military personnel. That is why there were USN personnel taking the course. In addition in some scenes there were "Colored" (to use the term in use at the time) troops training. There weren't any "Colored" Ranger units until 2ND Ranger CO (Airborne) was stood up in Korea during the war there.

The school was commanded by LT COL Henry Mucci who later was made commander of 98TH Field Artillery Battalion and tasked with converting it into a Ranger Battalion which he did and the unit was designated 6TH Ranger Battalion.


Mark,
How right you are.

Ltc. Henry Mucci and his 6th Ranger Bn. are famous for a very important, and successful, POW rescue at Cabanatuan (rescued the Bataan Death March survivors before they were murdered by the Japanese).

austin
07-19-2010, 08:35 AM
Great set of videos. Men were men back then.

P.D.
07-19-2010, 09:50 AM
... I did notice the navy denims, ...
Actually the Pre-war Army wore blue denims as a work uniform. Some of the regulars like my dad, an Army Peal Harbor survivor (also a Vet of the Solomon Ils, Marshall Ils, Gilbert Ils, etc campaigns), still had them into the early years of the war.

WIG19
07-30-2010, 09:19 AM
Can you even imagine a General officer in Obama's Army saying something so non PC? Even in WWII fighting generals were few. I wonder if they even exist today.

I was very pleased to see the highlighted text, above, and posted it here. I do not know of any current General Officers who would speak like this Lt. Gen. Lesley James McNair did in 1942. The business of warriors is killing the enemy and it is important to have the correct mindset to work 'effectively'. The very restrictive and politically-developed ROE tie the hands of our military who are on the 'sharp end' and directly lead to the deaths of American warriors.When people use the old 'saw' from Cooper ("It was a different country then.") it's not figurative. A fine gentleman shared with me a John Ek booklet on knife fighting (and his knives) from 1942, and there is no misreading possible. Many of the instructional texts of the time got right down to business, something always welcomed, by me anyway.

KarlinPhoenix
07-30-2010, 09:31 AM
When people use the old 'saw' from Cooper ("It was a different country then.") it's not figurative. A fine gentleman shared with me a John Ek booklet on knife fighting (and his knives) from 1942, and there is no misreading possible. Many of the instructional texts of the time got right down to business, something always welcomed, by me anyway.

WIG19,
Many thanks for sharing that information.

Reminds me once more how the majority of our elected federal government has not the will to win on the battlefield or our borders.

blackballed
07-30-2010, 09:53 AM
Man, if only to train under a leadership like this one. When men are allowed to lead as men, great things happen - like victory.

D Ron Evans
07-30-2010, 10:31 AM
Interesting stuff. I wonder who the Instructor was?

Wasn't it Francois d'Eliscu?

KarlinPhoenix
07-30-2010, 11:13 AM
Wasn't it Francois d'Eliscu?

Yes, you are correct.

I found this old magazine entry about Ltc. d'Eliscu:


http://books.google.com/books?id=DtcDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=Francois+d'Eliscu&source=bl&ots=zw2e_RymbS&sig=8z8ILCrIA4j39o7k499vwoqJPZ8&hl=en&ei=vRFTTNP3GIyWsgOY2NnNBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CC4Q6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=Francois%20d'Eliscu&f=false


And here is another article on Combatives that features Ltc. d'Eliscu:
http://books.google.com/books?id=xdYDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA40&lpg=PA40&dq=Francois+d'Eliscu&source=bl&ots=NmQ2PqeFD_&sig=fZfkY8gpq1U9ou_lqpmpInIh5kQ&hl=en&ei=mRNTTLmCLYKcsQPrk4jPBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CBcQ6AEwAjgK#v=onepage&q=Francois%20d'Eliscu&f=false


And,

http://books.google.com/books?id=PFAEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA112&lpg=PA112&dq=Francois+d'Eliscu&source=bl&ots=pOxU2NXK-a&sig=1NPE0zP0ZdCo4OC5YhLX0sS0SSs&hl=en&ei=4xRTTMj3NY6osQPfiLHSBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CB0Q6AEwBDgU#v=onepage&q=Francois%20d'Eliscu&f=false

Andy O.
07-30-2010, 08:55 PM
Good find. Thanks for sharing.