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View Full Version : Thoughts on the ACE folding stock?



irishmike
07-21-2009, 10:02 PM
Looking to get a folding stock for my ongoing S-12 project. I'm a little nervous of the Tromix stock with it being plastic, I read a review of a guy who broke his in two by stepping on it while in a case. Curious about ACE, or even an AK-100 style folding stock.. Any thoughts?

Jaxon L.
07-21-2009, 10:26 PM
i put an ace on my Saiga sgl-20. LOP is good, comfortable. don't need the rubber pad they include. lock up is tight, easy to deploy. not the best, but pretty good. ak-100 would be better but more money and work involved.

just my .02

FrankDude72
07-21-2009, 11:34 PM
Ok, now I'm wondering myself, as I have 2 S-12s at Tromix right now.

Those who have the ACE or Tromix or both stocks....

If I was going to beat the snot out of somebody via buttstrokes... would the Tromix stock hold up?

Kafr
07-22-2009, 12:23 AM
Ok, now I'm wondering myself, as I have 2 S-12s at Tromix right now.

Those who have the ACE or Tromix or both stocks....

If I was going to beat the snot out of somebody via buttstrokes... would the Tromix stock hold up?

it is plastic... I wouldn't use it for that.

Jaxon L.
07-22-2009, 01:10 AM
Ok, now I'm wondering myself, as I have 2 S-12s at Tromix right now.

Those who have the ACE or Tromix or both stocks....

If I was going to beat the snot out of somebody via buttstrokes... would the Tromix stock hold up?


I'm not too sure the Ace would either.

HarvKY
07-22-2009, 01:40 AM
Looking to get a folding stock for my ongoing S-12 project. I'm a little nervous of the Tromix stock with it being plastic, I read a review of a guy who broke his in two by stepping on it while in a case. Curious about ACE, or even an AK-100 style folding stock.. Any thoughts?

RE: Tromix stocks
Its not "plastic" per se, anymore than Glocks are "plastic"

As a point of reference I found this quote?/posting by Mr Ash of Tromix fame :-) [hope he doesnt mind my using it here]

QUOTE (BobAsh @ Jul 11 2008, 07:46 AM) http://forum.saiga-12.com/style_images/1/post_snapback.gif (http://www.warriortalk.com/index.php?act=findpost&pid=247210)
It is a steel-reinforced poly stock. This is the 3rd generation design...Tromix developed the stock working directly with the manufacturer, Lage industries. We've sold thousands without failure.

I'm rather old school so the Ace look of metal tubes kinda appeals to me more but I dont think its any stronger than the Tromix FWIW.

Cheers,
HarvKY

Kafr
07-22-2009, 04:48 AM
RE: Tromix stocks
Its not "plastic" per se, anymore than Glocks are "plastic"

As a point of reference I found this quote?/posting by Mr Ash of Tromix fame :-) [hope he doesnt mind my using it here]

QUOTE (BobAsh @ Jul 11 2008, 07:46 AM) http://forum.saiga-12.com/style_images/1/post_snapback.gif (http://www.warriortalk.com/index.php?act=findpost&pid=247210)
It is a steel-reinforced poly stock. This is the 3rd generation design...Tromix developed the stock working directly with the manufacturer, Lage industries. We've sold thousands without failure.

I'm rather old school so the Ace look of metal tubes kinda appeals to me more but I dont think its any stronger than the Tromix FWIW.

Cheers,
HarvKY

Except for the fact that rifle butt stocks receive more abuse (if they really get used) than a pistol does. You should see some of things I have done to rifles in the military just training. Shit happens and I honestly would not bet my life on a polymer stock like that. Your time, money, rifle and preference. I am just telling you mine. I prefer a steel stock that isn't going to crack or break from stress. There are better stocks out there. I don't like the ACE stock either. It sucks... I know because I own one.

cynical
07-22-2009, 10:53 AM
The top tube of the ACE skeleton stock is Delrin, not metal, so I don't think it has a big advantage (if any) over the Tromix. I've never heard of a Tromix stock breaking like that, but anything is possible.

For me the big difference was price. I have been pretty happy with the ACE stock on my rifle, so I got another one for my S-12 conversion. The ACE was $65 with either the 1/2" or thicker 1" rubber recoil pad. The standard Tromix goes for $85, and that "pad" is hard plastic. The Tromix is also available with a Limbsaver pad, but that's $150.

If you're willing to pay a premium over the cost of the ACE, and really want all metal, get the DPH skeleton stock. It wasn't available when I bought my second ACE stock, and the long wait time and piss-poor customer service and communications from ACE make me glad for the additional choices now.

7.62_fan
07-22-2009, 06:45 PM
...If I was going to beat the snot out of somebody via buttstrokes... would the Tromix stock hold up?

I don't know about the Tromix, but these East German sidefolding stocks (http://www.onesourcetactical.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1634) that Gabe sells are extremely rugged and recommended by infidels for use as a club.

http://www.onesourcetactical.com/ProductImages/akfoldingstockeg.jpg

lilc
07-22-2009, 06:53 PM
I don't know about the Tromix, but these East German sidefolding stocks (http://www.onesourcetactical.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1634) that Gabe sells are extremely rugged and recommended by infidels for use as a club.Other than the fact that they might be a bit harsh on a 12-gauge, I don't think there is much that a wire side-folder cannot withstand. They are super-tough. I have East German and Romanian variants installed on my rifles, and I'll probably get a Polish side-folder from OST for my new build. All of my Fuller custom rifles have East German wire stocks finished to match the receiver. It is one AK stock you never have to worry about...

http://www.pbase.com/image/113659110.jpg

Juggernaut_S12
07-22-2009, 06:55 PM
I don't know about the Tromix, but these East German sidefolding stocks (http://www.onesourcetactical.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1634) that Gabe sells are extremely rugged and recommended by infidels for use as a club.

http://www.onesourcetactical.com/ProductImages/akfoldingstockeg.jpg


No OEM retainer hook for Saigas... it would take a ton of work..

I believe that Lage makes the Tromix stock...

Topmaul
07-22-2009, 06:56 PM
I plan to put an Ace Folder on my S-12 some day

Juggernaut_S12
07-22-2009, 07:08 PM
I used to have one on my Saiga....
the old blocks did not have the 3 deg angle and put the stock at an un natural angle.....

so I went with a totally different set up....

I hear the newer blocks don't have that problem...

Best bet... chop the back of the receiver and weld on a back plate....

FrankDude72
07-22-2009, 07:25 PM
Tony used to install those Romy folders on some S-12s.

I remember his website specifically recommended it "for those who like pain!".

Hmmmm, guess when I get my saigas back I'll have to see how comfortable I am doing buttstrokes with them....

lilc
07-22-2009, 07:32 PM
Tony used to install those Romy folders on some S-12s. I remember his website specifically recommended it "for those who like pain!"...Too true. (Although we tough warrior types don't complain about that, now, do we?! :D) Jim Fuller also recommended against wire stocks when he did my S12 conversions. I went with simple K-VAR synthetic fixed stocks instead.

In truth, my Saigas are house guns for defense. They sit at the ready arms reach where I spend most of my time (one in my office for during the day and the other by my bed at night) and are locked up the rest of the time. Even with a wire folder, my 19" Saiga 12 is a little too long to squeeze comfortably in a small-size Sneaky Bags Discreet Rifle Bag. (An AK-100 style folder doesn't have a tang to accommodate, so maybe that would work if you had an S12 built with one...) I just don't have the same pressing need to make them compact for discreet carry that I do for my fighting rifles, so I am fine without folders on them...

http://www.pbase.com/image/103317445.jpg

FrankDude72
07-22-2009, 07:35 PM
*shrugs*

Well if I really don't like the Tromix stocks I always have my S-12S with the Russian-made AK-100 style stock. Seems pretty study so far. :D

BTW illc, your S-12s do look awesome as well.

lilc
07-22-2009, 07:37 PM
BTW illc, your S-12s do look awesome as well.Thx, bro. Jim does a great job in the execution, no matter what his clients' tastes and requirements call for...

Juggernaut_S12
07-22-2009, 07:50 PM
The lifting and polishing to get a folder on a Saiga 12 can eat a lot of time....

to Quote Tony Rumore when discussing the install of a 100 series folder in a saiga..

"The time it takes to install that folding stock on an S-12 is completely insane. I can do five or six COMPLETE full blown conversions in the same amount of time it takes to install that stock."

Mr Fuller a while back did a BEAUTIFUL build on a saiga with the 100 series folder...


That is the beauty of the ACE and the ACE block or receiver plate.... no hacking into the receiver to install a hook...

Jim Fuller
07-23-2009, 04:20 AM
The AK100 stocks are a real challenge to install on the S-12. The latching mechanisim is non standard and has to be made unless you can get the OEM parts from Russia. It is very labor intensive.

Juggernaut_S12
07-23-2009, 07:40 AM
The AK100 stocks are a real challenge to install on the S-12. The latching mechanisim is non standard and has to be made unless you can get the OEM parts from Russia. It is very labor intensive.

LOVE THAT BUILD!!!! Is that one of Brian's '74 style MB on the front end?????

McGyver
07-23-2009, 03:34 PM
Mine is similar to the one featured in SHOTGUN GUNFIGHTING DVD. It has the Tromix stock, an Ace folder and a Magnolia State Armory Internal Stock Adapter. Many of the parts for the build came from One Source. Since there have not been any pics of the Tromix stock yet:

And yes, that is the hinge pin working out of the Ace folding mechanism. I need to stake it.http://i602.photobucket.com/albums/tt104/WolfeIII/Saiga-12/Saiga12Conva.jpg

FrankDude72
07-23-2009, 06:03 PM
Just in case I misled anyone...

My S-12S's stock and receiver are 100% Russian. :D (In the country originally for LEO-only purchase but declared surplus.)

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m216/EvilFrankDude/Saiga12foldleft1.jpg

Judging on what I heard of the difficulty on an install, I wouldn't dare ask Tony or Jim or whomever to undergo so much ghastly effort installing one.

But since Izhmash already made it that way, I ain't gonna complain.;)

Juggernaut_S12
07-23-2009, 06:39 PM
Just in case I misled anyone...

My S-12S's stock and receiver are 100% Russian. :D (In the country originally for LEO-only purchase but declared surplus.)

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m216/EvilFrankDude/Saiga12foldleft1.jpg

Judging on what I heard of the difficulty on an install, I wouldn't dare ask Tony or Jim or whomever to undergo so much ghastly effort installing one.

But since Izhmash already made it that way, I ain't gonna complain.;)

You have a true 12C? sweet!!!!
If you EVER want to sell it..... please hit me up...

The difficulty comes in converting an IZ 108 or 109....

FrankDude72
07-24-2009, 08:55 PM
Regarding the ACE and Tromix adapters, has anybody tried sticking an actual Galil stock in them?
How'd that work?

I have a bunch of Galil stocks lying around currently. They seem plenty sturdy for emergency head schwonking.

How would that effect the parts count for Tromix builds, as all my legit Galil stocks are Izzy or South African.