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JIMLOU
11-05-2004, 07:24 PM
Recently, our high school lost its "resource" officer due to the expiration of federal grants that allowed the county SD to post an armed duputy in the building.

I am a teacher in the building and my other hat is that of a military criminal investigator. I have trained with Ayoob, Cain, Brevit, Inosanto and Yeager. I am contemplating approaching the administration with a suggestion that I be granted the approval to serve as the school's safety officer (its a rural county, and if the administration complied, I would see no problem with the sheriff appointing me as a special deputy for that purpose).

If approved, I am debating as to what the best carry piece/carry gear would be for that role. Dress is khakis and polo. Given that fact, I am leaning toward a G26 on the ankle and spare 17 mag on the other ankle in a DeSantis rig designed for that purpose.

I am also concerned about tactical considerations. I believe it would be of the utmost importance that the fact that I am armed be kept on the DL as anyone planning an attack on the facility would make it a priority to eliminate me at the outset, thus negating my armed presence in the first place.

I would also appreciate any tactical advice for someone filling this role, ie., how best to respond to an "active shooter" scenario.

I hesitated posting this question, given the typical recoil that most have to such an idea. However, if you could have seen how unprepared the previous "resource" officers were, you would understand my concerns to better protect our kids. Besides, this is Gabe's place, isn't it?

Thanks in advance.

Q-ball
11-05-2004, 07:46 PM
I for one support you decision and appreciate someone that is there for the safety of the kids and staff. One question-why carry a primary weapon, that you might have to deploy in a very fast manner, on the furthest point of you body?

JIMLOU
11-05-2004, 07:50 PM
Good question. As Mas taught me, rule #2 is to have the gun...in hand (#1 is, of course, have a gun).

The top priority is a low profile. If I show up everyday with an unbloused shirt, the kiddies will start to ask questions. If the flag goes up, I will have the necessary seconds to withdraw the piece and get to the problem. I don't plan on a quickdraw. Thanks for the kind words and question.

michael
11-05-2004, 07:57 PM
You might look at the Joshua Covert holster that Dale makes. It is a shirt tucker and very concealable.

JJ1
11-05-2004, 08:26 PM
Take a look at the FIST pocket holsters. I am currently carrying a Kimber Ultra II in one. It is very low profile and much quicker to get into action than a ankle holster. I frequently carry a bug, 5 shot j frame, in a ankle holster but would prefer for it not to be the primary sidearm. The Joshua Covert is also a good option. Another is the smart carry, I have also used it for the Untra or the J frame, but it is not fast but very well concealed.

Stealth is going to be a primary issue in a school.

JJ1

DaveJames
11-05-2004, 10:06 PM
FIrst how are you going to handle wearing 2 hats with out the students finding out? As a resource officer you shoud be in the public eye, and out and about so to speak.

I would skip the 26 and opt for either a 17/19 framed weapon, as I see it ,better round count and a little better controlability.Calibere dosen't matter to me one way or the other as long as its 9mm or larger.

I think your idea is a good one, but may be more than its possible to handle properly

battleground
11-06-2004, 11:10 AM
Consider being an armed teacher and nothing else. Be there to defend when the worst is happening.

DragonRider
11-06-2004, 12:34 PM
Or a smart carry..... Please let us know how it turns out. I wish you luck.

John

Sam Spade
11-06-2004, 12:39 PM
From the cop's point of view:

I'd avoid the Special Deputy thing. At some point you'll run into conflicting obligations. That will affect your abilities as both a teacher and the potential rescuer. I wouldn't want to see you doing a disservice to your students on regular issues just to get some small (or non-existant) advantage for an active shooter thing. And, in a small rural area, your status isn't going to remain secret--which means that the bad guys have the ability to find you out.

G26 and ankle rig sounds good to me. You have to remain completely off the radar screen. While there are tuckables, I'd be concerned about the unforseen "thunk" of sitting in a chair, or an unexpected embrace or something like that. Besides, if taken hostage, I'd expect BGs to be noticing waistlines far before ankles. I agree that you'll have a good chance of getting to your gun in plenty of time for the scenario your looking to. Smartcarry is another option.

Tactical advice: Prepare now for the possibility of shooting one of your students. More likely than Beslan is Lil' Jimmy gone bad. Hesitation on target gets you and innocents killed.

How to go about it? Charge the sound of the guns, ignoring wounded, unexploded ordinance, fleeing kids, smoke, fire alarms, sprinklers and everything else that detracts from "front sight, press". When the guns stop, slow down and search towards the last known location, because you don't want to be bushwacked. More shots--charge again. Control of your speed is vital: too fast and you find yourself in the doo-doo faster than you can shoot; too slow and you're allowing the casualty count to rise. This means that your charge isn't the same thing as a flat out sprint. (And, it ain't as simple on the ground as it is to write.) When you see the adversary, shoot him to the ground, then shoot him on the ground. (Suicide vests require a modification to Gabe's traditional chant. You must render the BG incapable of purposeful movement.)

Remember that you win if you isolate the BG. If he holes up in a restroom, you've stopped the killing. No need to go in if innocents aren't being killed and he's contained.

I think that you need to train until the movement and gun handling is reflexive--you're going to want all your brain cells available for dealing with the situation that presents, processing clues, and picking the optimal course of action--while your kids are being shot. I might not take this view with Joe Average who wants to have another tool in the box, in case bad things happen at the mall or something. You, though, are talking about another situation altogether, and I hope you appreciate the differences. To that end....

Recon now. Stay late a few nights and really walk the terrain. Identify the kill zones, where the assassins will look to do the most damage the quickest. Where do the kids assemble? Where can the shooter go? Where can he lay pipe bombs to take those who flee, or the first responders? Where are you most likely to be at lunch-time or assembly (for instance), and how will you get to the kill zone? What are the choke points where you'll have trouble getting through? Which doors open in, which out? How does this change if it's dark? How does this change if there's a lockdown?

You're signing up for a thankless task, in ways you probably haven't considered yet. For whatever it's worth, you have my respect. Welcome to the war.

JWnTN
11-06-2004, 04:29 PM
From the cop's point of view:

I'd avoid the Special Deputy thing. At some point you'll run into conflicting obligations.
In some states, it may not be legally possible to carry a firearm on school property without some law enforcement status.

DragonRider
11-06-2004, 06:45 PM
That is true, but in some areas the Principal/Head Adminstrator can give authorization I believe,

example in VA....

The exemptions set out in 18.2-308 shall apply, mutatis mutandis, to the provisions of this section. The provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) persons who possess such weapon or weapons as a part of the school's curriculum or activities, (ii) a person possessing a knife customarily used for food preparation or service and using it for such purpose, (iii) persons who possess such weapon or weapons as a part of any program sponsored or facilitated by either the school or any organization authorized by the school to conduct its programs either on or off the school premises, (iv) any law-enforcement officer, (v) any person who possesses a knife or blade which he uses customarily in his trade, or (vi) a person who possesses an unloaded firearm that is in a closed container, or a knife having a metal blade, in or upon a motor vehicle, or an unloaded shotgun or rifle in a firearms rack in or upon a motor vehicle. For the purposes of this paragraph, "weapon" includes a knife having a metal blade of three inches or longer and "closed container" includes a locked vehicle trunk.

There is the above possiblity given that language in VA.

My school that I work at does have body guards for some of the students who are armed. It also helps to back up to a Government Installation where it is normal for them to have MP5's at the guard house.....

John

JIMLOU
11-06-2004, 07:47 PM
Thanks for the advice so far. I continue to believe that a G26 on the ankle would be the most low profile/effective method of carry.

As to my exact position, I would envision continuing to be in the classroom, but filling a vital gap between an active shooter scenario and the precious time it would take for a unit from the SD to arrive on-scene.

Many have mentioned the need to, if necessary, act quickly. Let me assure you, that if the flag flew, I would act with utmost vigor in ending the situation quickly, regardless of the culprit.

I do agree that the matter of operational security is paramount. Please keep the suggestions coming.

rgrgak
11-06-2004, 11:57 PM
JIMLOU,

I dress in similar clothes to the ones you described. I always carry a Glock 19 IWB under a tucked-in shirt. (Comp-Tac C-TAC with V-clips) I carry two spare mags in a back pocket. I have at times carried a G26 on my ankle or in a front pocket. Both are good options but I consider the G19 to be better than the G26 because it has more capacity before reload and it has a longer grip for more stability. I consider the hip placement better than the others because it is faster, it is more consistent with most training, and because my front pocket is inaccessible when seated. I think the odds of getting spotted are about the same with all three options.

Regarding keeping things a secret: My coworkers know that I will come running if a violent attack started in the office. A few may suspect that I carry a gun, but only one (another WarriorTalk member) knows for sure. The fact that I carry isn't important, though. If outsiders attack the office, they will not know about me. If an insider started an attack, he would expect a response from me and may preemptively strike. But my character/personality/attitude designate me as a first-strike target - not my equipment and not any title or official designation.

Before discussing this with your school administrators, be aware that they will answer as school administrators rather than as individuals. I think our CFO may suspect I carry. (He knows I was an Army Ranger. He knows I shoot on a regular basis. He knows I've been to training since leaving the Army. And he knows that I will agressively respond to a violent attack on the office.) But I think he has decided to stick with a policy of "Don't ask, don't tell" so he can maintain plausible deniability in the event of lawsuits - which are sure to follow an "incident".

As "just another teacher", you CAN still talk to your co-workers and students regarding subjects such as self-defense and how to respond to a violent attack. You can probably even help organize drills, response plans, etc. Having a title really isn't necessary for this, although you'll probably be given one somewhere along the way if you regularly lead the school in that area. Carrying a gun is really irrelevant to these things.

I have considered joining the local sheriff's department as a reserve deputy. That would allow for better C3 (command, control, & communication) in the event of an incident. It would also give me legal authorization to carry in schools, bars, and other places off-limits to CHL-carrying. The things holding me back from this are:
1. I work in a different county from where I live. Which department should I join?
2. I must be state-certified (over 500 hours of academy training) to become a reserve deputy. That's a big committment!
3. I have some key responsibilities as a member of my company's disaster recovery team. Who gets me in the event of a local disaster?

Hopefully my thoughts and experiences are of use as you contemplate your next move.

dimsum
11-13-2004, 09:58 AM
Recently, our high school lost its "resource" officer due to the expiration of federal grants that allowed the county SD to post an armed duputy in the building.

I teach too and there is no f'ing way I would walk into that building without our resource officer. I teach inner city kids and I always make sure I know what to do in any situation. The best defence in the classroom is martial arts training. But make sure you learn mostly blocks and holds. You can get into a lot of trouble with striking. A good block and hold until the resource officer arrives.... Oh wait sorry. Quit switch to private school. Go on strike until the city finds the funds to put the officers back into the building. You know they have it.