Sports Cars—Looking Ahead

[Faramir2]

Glancing at the recent posts about new motorcycles and at the Chariots of War thread made me decide to ask this question: With regard to sports cars within, say, $60K at the outside price, what do people recommend, both to purchase and to avoid? One day I would love to drive something snazzy, when (if?) the lawyer salary allows. Nonnegotiable for me personally is a manual transmission (a true manual with three pedals, not the electronic sport shifters some people will label a manual on car sites). Outside of that, I'm not terribly picky.

Presently I love the idea of an Audi S4 or A4, since the sedan body is a little more practical, a TT RS, or on the cheaper side of sport coupes, an MX-5 Miata, even something like a VW Golf R or GTI. Yeah, those are all fairly different vehicles, but this is all spitballing at this juncture and will likely remain so for a few years.

Thoughts, suggestions? I'm no ace driver, so while I'm a decent driver, I know my own limits and am not looking to drive like Steve McQueen; just not quite that skilled. More just thinking about something fun with some power and performance for when I want to use it. Most fun I've ever had driving a car was taking a ride in a friend's 1985 (I think) Ferrari 328 GTS, although I can't say I'd want to drive that all the time. Just a ton of fun to open up the throttle on a calm highway near my parents' place and enjoy the scream of that engine at redline in low gears.

[steve_k]

Out of the cars you listed I have taken a liking to the Golf R's the last few years. Check out The Humble Mechanic on Youtube, he recently did an autocross comparison of the MK8 GTI and Golf R that was pretty good in my opinion.

[Herbert West]

For a fun little car to to zip around in, fun to drive, peppy, and can carry boards in the fold-down-seat (or guncase) the GTI is a blast! Plus they're reliable and great on gas. I purchased two, a 2019 and 2020 for my nieces as their first cars when they became 18. Another option is used Porsche Boxster S, just as much fun as the GTI, seriously. You should drive them both and may opt for the GTI, and new a one otd is less than 30k, so spare cash for other goodies/ trips :-)

[chad newton]

Corvette with ls7.... I would also say a used turbo 911 with less then 50,000 miles....

[chad newton]

You can get a manual transmission in both, to me it’s not a “sports car” with out...

[chad newton]

If you want a track car pm me, I will tell you which one to get.... Weekend driver probably one of those two, either one will scare you to death....

[Crusader8207]

Our company has a 2019 A4 as a pool car. I took it to Waco and back (from Tulsa) a few weeks ago. I loved driving that car so much, I have a new one on order for myself. It rode well, got incredible gas mileage, and just hummed along at 80mph with grace. While I love a great sports car, I enjoy a sports sedan. My car is due in June. Can't wait.

62650

[Gabriel Suarez]

Shield Maiden had an Audi S4. Very - ridiculously - fast. Had an AZ DPS guy with us one time on the way to dinner after class and he said, "Ok...I can get you out of any DPS ticket - let's see what this will do. I think were up to 100 MPH within a few seconds and before he could say, "Ok...that is enough".

She has a Mercedes C43 now, but I would still prefer the Audi.

[686+]

2016 and pre A4 engines are a crap shoot, unless you let it go well pre 100,000 mi. The TT is by far the most fun car, but once the wife drives it you might only get visitation rights, emphasis on might.
If you can get a used TTRS and make sure it’s not been launched repeatedly you will love it. It has a 100 times launch limit for the life of the car, or did. So check carefully.

[wfbont007]

Bought a 2020 Nissan 370z Nismo last July. Very fun car. Cold air intake and exhaust being installed short.

[Crusader8207]

Wish the S4 would fit in the budget. Sweet car for sure.


Shield Maiden had an Audi S4. Very - ridiculously - fast. Had an AZ DPS guy with us one time on the way to dinner after class and he said, "Ok...I can get you out of any DPS ticket - let's see what this will do. I think were up to 100 MPH within a few seconds and before he could say, "Ok...that is enough".

She has a Mercedes C43 now, but I would still prefer the Audi.

[chad newton]

Bought a 2020 Nissan 370z Nismo last July. Very fun car. Cold air intake and exhaust being installed short.
If your doing exhaust you should find a good turbo kit and tuner....

[LawDog]

I’m a truck guy, and always will be. But if I were buying a toy car (not a daily driver), it would be a late 60s or early 70s muscle car. Maybe a first generation Camaro or a GTO. You can find great ones for far less than $60k, but you’ll quickly spend what’s left on gas.

[chad newton]

I’m a truck guy, and always will be. But if I were buying a toy car (not a daily driver), it would be a late 60s or early 70s muscle car. Maybe a first generation Camaro or a GTO. You can find great ones for far less than $60k, but you’ll quickly spend what’s left on gas.
I have three trucks, but I like fast cars too.... Truck and trailer are very hand to have when you break your toys...

[chad newton]

You should see my 71 chevelle I’m building btw, you might appreciate it....

[UNO]

Glancing at the recent posts about new motorcycles and at the Chariots of War thread made me decide to ask this question: With regard to sports cars within, say, $60K at the outside price, what do people recommend, both to purchase and to avoid? One day I would love to drive something snazzy, when (if?) the lawyer salary allows. Nonnegotiable for me personally is a manual transmission (a true manual with three pedals, not the electronic sport shifters some people will label a manual on car sites). Outside of that, I'm not terribly picky.

Presently I love the idea of an Audi S4 or A4, since the sedan body is a little more practical, a TT RS, or on the cheaper side of sport coupes, an MX-5 Miata, even something like a VW Golf R or GTI. Yeah, those are all fairly different vehicles, but this is all spitballing at this juncture and will likely remain so for a few years.

Thoughts, suggestions? I'm no ace driver, so while I'm a decent driver, I know my own limits and am not looking to drive like Steve McQueen; just not quite that skilled. More just thinking about something fun with some power and performance for when I want to use it. Most fun I've ever had driving a car was taking a ride in a friend's 1985 (I think) Ferrari 328 GTS, although I can't say I'd want to drive that all the time. Just a ton of fun to open up the throttle on a calm highway near my parents' place and enjoy the scream of that engine at redline in low gears.

I mean, you've covered ground in this post from a sedan to a roadster. You'd need to further define your needs/wants. I personally am a fan of well balanced vehicles with amazing dynamics. Given that, I'd recommend something like a Cayman 718 GTS. Snag a used/certified one if you can find one in your budget, and prepare for maintenance costs!

If you want to enjoy world class performance on the cheap, and give up some of that "feel" but have higher overall performance limits, the hottest Corvette you can afford in C6,7,8 guise will handily do it.

I used to drive sports cars, but now cannot, and need AWD SUV's because of where I choose to live.

Stuff I've owned:

C6 Z06 (Super well mannered/rounded, absurdly fast, like a Cobalt inside though).
370Z Sport/Touring (Shitty suspension, horrific manual, but great interior and good engine)
2001 WS.6 (Fast in a straight line for its time, slick T56 transmission, glass jaw 7.5 diff and "very 90's" suspension.)

Stuff friends have owned that I've driven:

2013 BRZ: Really fun little car, low on power though.
2017? WRX: well rounded, handled well, terrible power delivery and weak engine.
2019 WRX STi: Way too loud for what it offers, horrible mpg for only 310bhp, amazing AWD and good suspension, if a bit unrefined, good transmission, unforgivable turbo lag without a tune

[Cody C]

I know you want a manual but for 60k you can get an audi RS3... nothing mentioned here beyond the s4 or the c43 will compare to it.

My goal is that is my next car.

The Volkswagen is ok, but if you plan on doing any modifications, you never get the hp per dollar return you get with other cars. The rs3 has enough going for it you can leave it stock or a simple tune would be plenty.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[Johnny C!]

My current sports car in a 2008 MB E350 Wagon.
It has very sporty acceleration, handles way
better than anyone would expect, it's very
practical for trips, decent gas mileage, and
great lines. My previous one was a 1995 that
went to over 200k. It was still running good
when I traded it in on the 2008. I have a good
local MB mechanic and I have had no major
expenses on these 2 gassers. My previous
diesel sedans were a bit more problematic.

Edit to add: These could be found on the used
market for decent prices, pre-covid, anyway.
I haven't priced these lately.

Representative photo, but exactly like mine.

https://www.bulautosales.com/galleria_images/410/410_main_l.jpg

[jesselp]

62657
Me and my Lotus Elise.

It is the epitome of a "sports car." it is a toy designed to put a smile on your face. Up until recently it was inexpensive to buy (for what it is) and it remains super inexpensive and easy to maintain and run. Values have almost doubled in the past two years, but it is still a unique car you can pick up for less than $50k and do all the maintenance yourself, if you are so inclined.

Highly recommended, if you have another daily driver.

[coastalcop]

C7 Vette, last year you can get a manual, and the interior is significantly upgraded from the C6 fair amount of room for TWO.

[Faramir2]

Thanks for all the suggestions, folks. Likely I would be looking for something that doubles as a daily driver and a fun car, although maybe some day I will have both the disposable cash and the space to have something that's simply a fun weekend driver only. Looking lot like I should pay attention to the Audi or BMW sedans and the VW Golf R—looked at Humble Mechanic's stuff and did a little reading and liking that idea.

Other suggestions, definitely open to them. Can't say I wouldn't love a Porsche Boxster or Cayman, or a C7 Corvette—coastalcop, I looked the 'vette up after you suggested it, and man are those ever sweet cars. Definitely tempting.

[psalms23dad]

And from left field...
There is the option of having a kit car built.
Tons of bodys to pick from. Not only can you pick the body but also the power train, suspension, brakes, interior, wheels ect. You literally can pick everything you want exactly how you want it.

[coastalcop]

Thanks for all the suggestions, folks. Likely I would be looking for something that doubles as a daily driver and a fun car, although maybe some day I will have both the disposable cash and the space to have something that's simply a fun weekend driver only. Looking lot like I should pay attention to the Audi or BMW sedans and the VW Golf R—looked at Humble Mechanic's stuff and did a little reading and liking that idea.

Other suggestions, definitely open to them. Can't say I wouldn't love a Porsche Boxster or Cayman, or a C7 Corvette—coastalcop, I looked the 'vette up after you suggested it, and man are those ever sweet cars. Definitely tempting.

https://www.carscoops.com/2017/11/datsun-based-ferrari-250-gto-replica/


I was looking at one of these prepped for vintage racing........ I ultimately couldnt make the use case for it though Ive had a soft spot for and owned the 240, 260, and 280z cars, one of which was a scarab v-8 conversion.


The C7 was a great car when I had it, got rid of it for a F-250 when the protest world was going crazy. Backfilled with a Miata RF GTS , that was great but not enough room for my intended use. Replaced with a 17 mustang GT convertible with the performance package.

The mustang is NOT a sports car in the classic sense, but makes a great GT car.

[apamburn]

Audi is hard to beat. We have one.

My daily driver is a g35 coupe. I think they are great looking but lack in the power department compared to other makes.

350/370/400z is along those same lines but classic looks.

[Mike OTDP]

Nonnegotiable for me personally is a manual transmission (a true manual with three pedals, not the electronic sport shifters some people will label a manual on car sites). Outside of that, I'm not terribly picky.

Presently I love the idea of an Audi S4 or A4, since the sedan body is a little more practical, a TT RS, or on the cheaper side of sport coupes, an MX-5 Miata, even something like a VW Golf R or GTI.
Hmm...A 1990 Miata was my daily driver for 13 years. Retired it with 243,000 miles on it. Incredibly maneuverable, decent interior, and not a whole lot of trunk space. A delight with the top down - and quite warm, I could drive it with the top down to about 50 degrees. If baggage space isn't a big consideration, I'd put that at the top of my list.

Right now, I'm on my second BMW 3-series convertible. But those are now available only with an automatic transmission. After nearly 400,000 miles behind a stick shift, I'm lazy. And would rather have a convertible than a clutch pedal. I looked, hard, at a Boxster, but I think it's even less practical than a Miata. It's got about the same amount of storage space, but in two trunks instead of one.

[Redneck Zen]

Laugh all you want, but I adored my Mazdaspeed3 ... 270+ HP, six speed, hugged the road like your mama hugged your daddy the night were you conceived. It was a Q-ship, black, nonchalant and ready to pick up groceries or run the backroads of Kentucky. It was destroyed when a lady smashed into it parked in front of my gym. I miss that car.

Also, another nod toward Mazda, my buddy rebuilt a Miata for road racing ... great results on a budget.

Alsoooo ... Subaru WRX, if you can find that that hasn't been modded by some youngster ... or Plasti-Dipped to death. <sigh>

It's all about the money, obvouisly. If I had my druthers -- and was a decade or two younger, I'd hock my soul for an Audi.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOWn1WSYhVQ

[chad newton]

Laugh all you want, but I adored my Mazdaspeed3 ... 270+ HP, six speed, hugged the road like your mama hugged your daddy the night were you conceived. It was a Q-ship, black, nonchalant and ready to pick up groceries or run the backroads of Kentucky. It was destroyed when a lady smashed into it parked in front of my gym. I miss that car.

Also, another nod toward Mazda, my buddy rebuilt a Miata for road racing ... great results on a budget.

Alsoooo ... Subaru WRX, if you can find that that hasn't been modded by some youngster ... or Plasti-Dipped to death. <sigh>

It's all about the money, obvouisly. If I had my druthers -- and was a decade or two younger, I'd hock my soul for an Audi.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOWn1WSYhVQ
Hahahahaha....


Just joking....

[Faramir2]

https://www.carscoops.com/2017/11/datsun-based-ferrari-250-gto-replica/


I was looking at one of these prepped for vintage racing........ I ultimately couldnt make the use case for it though Ive had a soft spot for and owned the 240, 260, and 280z cars, one of which was a scarab v-8 conversion.


The C7 was a great car when I had it, got rid of it for a F-250 when the protest world was going crazy. Backfilled with a Miata RF GTS , that was great but not enough room for my intended use. Replaced with a 17 mustang GT convertible with the performance package.

The mustang is NOT a sports car in the classic sense, but makes a great GT car.

With the Miata and Mustang, is your goal to have space for things like bags for weekend trips, taking a cooler with lunch for a picnic, stuff like that? I love the idea of a Miata, but I'm practical enough to want something that can actually carry a few extra things in it, which a Miata certainly cannot (no matter how much fun it would be to drive). One reason I kinda like the sedans and Golf R, I guess, even though I'm also drawn to the true sports car.

apamburn, which Audi do you have?

Redneck Zen, my current vehicle is a regular Mazda3—not nearly as zippy as the Speed3, but it's got some punch. I'll bet that Speed3 was especially fun.

Yondering, I'm glad for that quick explanation of the performance differences between RWD and FWD. My Mazda3 is FWD, and I've noticed it doesn't love hammering through curves quite as well as the punch of the gears and the engine could probably accomplish in a FWD car. (Although, last night my wife and I were driving to a professor's house, and I pushed it through a curve; she said, "This is fun; we gotta take your car" to the mountains in August, on a trip we have planned.) Granted, only RWD I've driven other than the friend's Ferrari and my dad's old pickup truck is my wife's 2001 Lexus GS300—that luxury suspension does NOT handle like my Mazda does on curvy roads. We drove it to the mountains in Georgia last December, and I figured out real quick that I couldn't take the curves nearly as quickly as I could in my car.

[UNO]

Keep maintenance in mind, too. A buddy of mine bought a CLA35AMG only to return it when he found out the cost of actual ownership.

A service every 10K miles: $400
B Service every other 10K miles: $800
Transmission service and Spark Plugs at 50 and 60K, respectively, $1400 for both/togather.
AMG brakes $2K or so for the fronts, and they last about 20-25K miles per the dealership.

That's not counting tires, wipers, belts, that sort of thing, either. So if you buy a vehicle like an MB, you need to just go ahead and add $200/mo to the note for your PM. T his is why I like Japanese and American cars. My RDX is stoopid cheap to maintain compared to a Q5/GLC300/X3.

[coastalcop]

With the Miata and Mustang, is your goal to have space for things like bags for weekend trips, taking a cooler with lunch for a picnic, stuff like that? I love the idea of a Miata, but I'm practical enough to want something that can actually carry a few extra things in it, which a Miata certainly cannot (no matter how much fun it would be to drive). One reason I kinda like the sedans and Golf R, I guess, even though I'm also drawn to the true sports car.

apamburn, which Audi do you have?

Redneck Zen, my current vehicle is a regular Mazda3—not nearly as zippy as the Speed3, but it's got some punch. I'll bet that Speed3 was especially fun.

Yondering, I'm glad for that quick explanation of the performance differences between RWD and FWD. My Mazda3 is FWD, and I've noticed it doesn't love hammering through curves quite as well as the punch of the gears and the engine could probably accomplish in a FWD car. (Although, last night my wife and I were driving to a professor's house, and I pushed it through a curve; she said, "This is fun; we gotta take your car" to the mountains in August, on a trip we have planned.) Granted, only RWD I've driven other than the friend's Ferrari and my dad's old pickup truck is my wife's 2001 Lexus GS300—that luxury suspension does NOT handle like my Mazda does on curvy roads. We drove it to the mountains in Georgia last December, and I figured out real quick that I couldn't take the curves nearly as quickly as I could in my car.


The deciding factor was road-trips, With the vette and the mustang there is enough room to lay the seat back when the sun warms up and the XO wants to fill the car with ZZZZs. She also had room on the armsrest. We could pack for a week in the trunk of the Miata ( I’ve owned at least one of each generation ove the years) but no arm rest room and no laying the seat back ( something that adds LOTS of domestic tranquility on a 400 mile day).

I would have gotten another C7 ( mine had the smoked see through targa) save that a low mile sample that was 45k when I bought the first one was around 60k. The mustang because it was a manual was low mileage and ford certified at a price point that actually made it reasonable. I made about 6k over what I bought the RF Miata for negating the price premium vehicles are bringing, heck the profit off my F-250 paid for my ford excursion ( v10 gas model).

Between the excursion for hauling/camping/hunting, the motorcycles for day trips and guy trips, The g-ride for work, I knew the GT car wouldn’t see as much use, and I couldn’t see my way clear on a +15k markup.

I looked at C8 vettes, but while sticker on one specced the way I would want it is about 70k, you can’t find one used specced like that for under 100k.

[apamburn]

apamburn, which Audi do you have?


A4.

It is surprisingly quick and sporty despite being a sedan.

[chad newton]

Another option I see you could do is get a classic and it way better of an actual investment. My dad had a 56 190 sl restored in the early 80s when they were a lot cheaper and now they are a good investment and still owns to this day. If it’s a weekend car it would be a really cool driver. Just an example, there are some pretty nice old classics that can be had that will turn a lot more heads then a bmw or new Mercedes, plus they only gain value.
62674

[coastalcop]

On restorations stay away from anything with “Lucas” electronics, they couldn’t fit “lucifer” on the gauge face. When I was a kid my mom had a love of old British cars ( and a couple Italian ones). Pop taught me to cuss restoring and maintaining those. On the Italian jobs, some of those bolts were torqued down by someone with arms like Fuzzy or Dorkface, only the dude had tiny hands and was about 4 1/2 feet tall to fit into those spaces. I not so fondly remember being inverted with my legs flopped over out the top of a X1/9 trying to get to and un torque the bolts on the clutch master cylinder .

[Faramir2]

If I ever restore something, it will be a long time from now. I have neither skills nor wherewithal to learn them at this point. Maybe much later in life, though, as there is something enticing about building a vehicle that looks unique and stands out a bit.

Wouldn't mind that Ferrari 328 GTS I've driven before, though, that's for sure.

[Faramir2]

A4.

It is surprisingly quick and sporty despite being a sedan.

Gotcha. I've read nothing but good things about those, necessarily increased maintenance and insurance costs aside. Pretty efficient and practical, while fun.

[golucky]

Gotcha. I've read nothing but good things about those, necessarily increased maintenance and insurance costs aside. Pretty efficient and practical, while fun.

Brother has A6. I've been impressed everytime I drive it. Also agree with the increased maintenance and insurance costs as experienced by my brother. Also, his weekend car is a vette.

[henri]

Sports cars...one word Porsche. No 4 door sedan really qualifies, not the Panamera 4s turbo, not the Audi S4, not the S class AMG, nothing with 4 doors. For the purist only a coupe will do. Have owned a myriad of 'just for fun' vehicles, none compared to Porsche, either 911s or Cayman S, most fun drivers ever ! And they qualify as daily drivers as well :-)

[StealthNeighbor]

Not a sports car, per se...but my turbo-charged Porsche Cayenne Diesel SUV tops at 150mph, gets 34 mpg highway / 30 mpg city, is classy / luxurious and can also tow 7700#. Unfortunately, it experiences (suffers from) those expensive oil changes and maintenance requirements mentioned already. Nevertheless, it's a nice SUV that checks lots of blocks simultaneously...

[henri]

Not a sports car, per se...but my turbo-charged Porsche Cayenne Diesel SUV tops at 150mph, gets 34 mpg highway / 30 mpg city, is classy / luxurious and can also tow 7700#. Unfortunately, it experiences (suffers from) those expensive oil changes and maintenance requirements mentioned already. Nevertheless, it's a nice SUV that checks lots of blocks simultaneously...
Are diesels still made ? Enjoy! Waiting on a 2022 Cayenne GTS coupe, hopefully by next week !

[UNO]

For those who don't know, if you're looking for a sport sedan, you should be looking at the S series rather than the A. The A series is their standard model line, and the S is the same basic body with some sort of engine upgrade plus bigger brakes and sporty suspension. Of course you can get sport suspension on the A series usually, and they ride firmer than a typical domestic to start with so that makes a lot of people consider them sporty, but the S is a step up for a sports car enthusiast.

I don't know what Audi does these days, but in the 2000's era and at least beginning of the 2010's the S model got the engine from the next size up A model, plus some hotter tuning. So the S4 started as an A4 but with the A6 engine package and hopped up a little. Then there was the RS series which were rare but were even higher performance.

Audi has made some cool cars, and they can be a blast to drive. Maintenance can be an absolute beast though. For an example, look into late 2000's S4 timing chain guides. 100K mile service interval, and they're located on the back of the engine. Easiest way to get the engine out was to remove the entire front clip. Oh, and there are a LOT of those guides in there too, and letting them go is known to destroy the engine. That service interval made a lot of 100K mile S4's sell for really cheap, like $3k-$4K because the owners didn't want to hassle with the repairs.

In contrast, I really liked my '01 BMW 330i partly because it was designed for easy service. I've had a lot of cars over the years, and that was one of the easiest cars to work on that I've ever put a wrench to. For BMW that can vary a lot with different chassis though so buyer beware, and they used a lot of plastic parts which tended to go bad over time with heat and age.

Careful. Audi now does "S Line" products. Its a badge and rim retrofit basically. Zero substance.

Here is what I ran into when selecting my fun but practical daily:

Vw products: engines are fun but a hassle to keep alive. DCTs are snappy but expensive to keep alive.
MB products: MB service is just absurdly expensive. Disgustingly so. I could literally go from a base to an AMG model for the amortized service costs per month, lol! Nuts.
BMW products: VANOS failures...and even if you're okay replacing several thousand in parts and labor every 100k mi, its not like VANOS just breaks...oh, no...it slowly fails on you so that the performance loss adds up insidiously over time.
Genesis: Stay tuned for engine fire recalls.
Ford ST/Sport: It's a Ford product. The Explorer has abysmal reliability. The Edge is just shoddily made. Hard pass on it all.

Ultimately the most fun and luxury I could find for under $60k in a new SUV was a loaded out Acura RDX.

Now, OP, I know this is unconventional, but have you looked into the loaded Mach Es, if you don't need roadtrip or long commute capability? Electric power is so addictive with instant torque. Until youve beaten on a PEV, you just cant understand. Try it before eschewing it, if it can fit your needs/lifestyle. Also, the tax breaks are nice.

[jesselp]

Sports cars...one word Porsche. No 4 door sedan really qualifies, not the Panamera 4s turbo, not the Audi S4, not the S class AMG, nothing with 4 doors. For the purist only a coupe will do. Have owned a myriad of 'just for fun' vehicles, none compared to Porsche, either 911s or Cayman S, most fun drivers ever ! And they qualify as daily drivers as well :-)

Here's mine:
62687
2019 911 Targa 4 GTS

[Faramir2]

Careful. Audi now does "S Line" products. Its a badge and rim retrofit basically. Zero substance.

Here is what I ran into when selecting my fun but practical daily:

Vw products: engines are fun but a hassle to keep alive. DCTs are snappy but expensive to keep alive.
MB products: MB service is just absurdly expensive. Disgustingly so. I could literally go from a base to an AMG model for the amortized service costs per month, lol! Nuts.
BMW products: VANOS failures...and even if you're okay replacing several thousand in parts and labor every 100k mi, its not like VANOS just breaks...oh, no...it slowly fails on you so that the performance loss adds up insidiously over time.
Genesis: Stay tuned for engine fire recalls.
Ford ST/Sport: It's a Ford product. The Explorer has abysmal reliability. The Edge is just shoddily made. Hard pass on it all.

Ultimately the most fun and luxury I could find for under $60k in a new SUV was a loaded out Acura RDX.

Now, OP, I know this is unconventional, but have you looked into the loaded Mach Es, if you don't need roadtrip or long commute capability? Electric power is so addictive with instant torque. Until youve beaten on a PEV, you just cant understand. Try it before eschewing it, if it can fit your needs/lifestyle. Also, the tax breaks are nice.

What tends to go wrong on VW engines? Definitely not interested in an electric vehicle, for a lot of reasons, though I hear you on the instant torque.

[Faramir2]

Here's mine:
62687
2019 911 Targa 4 GTS

Woo hoo hoo, snazzy...

[Faramir2]

Learned that VW dealership near me has a 2019 Golf R, so swung by to try to take it out for a quick spin for research purposes earlier but couldn't figure out which part of the dealership I needed to land at. Didn't have much time, so I just left, figuring I'd go back later this week. Sounds like a good idea to get a sense of whether I would enjoy driving the thing, and also to scratch the itch so I quit thinking about it this week (too much else to do).

And now it's gone. Guess someone else actually wanted to buy it. Ah well. I'll drive one another day.

[RedLeg0811]

You know why the Brits like warm beer right? Because Lucas Electronics makes fridges too.


On restorations stay away from anything with “Lucas” electronics, they couldn’t fit “lucifer” on the gauge face. When I was a kid my mom had a love of old British cars ( and a couple Italian ones). Pop taught me to cuss restoring and maintaining those. On the Italian jobs, some of those bolts were torqued down by someone with arms like Fuzzy or Dorkface, only the dude had tiny hands and was about 4 1/2 feet tall to fit into those spaces. I not so fondly remember being inverted with my legs flopped over out the top of a X1/9 trying to get to and un torque the bolts on the clutch master cylinder .

[henri]

Here's mine:
62687
2019 911 Targa 4 GTS

A work of art in lower Manhattan !

[David Bowman]

I bought a 2012 Chevy Camaro SS at the end of last year because I finally was able to get back into a fun/sorta daily car to supplement my old beater truck and the family car. Paid like 23,000 for it. Last car like this I had was about 25 years ago right out of college when I bought a 1992 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX Turbo with the AWD and the 5 speed. I should never have sold that car... But I digress...

Buddy of mine who still works for an agency near me regrettably sold his 2010 SS Camaro, told me he was coming back from the range one day in his 2010 and got it up to about 140 on some back roads and it was solid. Said the car corners smaller than the size would lead you to believe, and he said that despite sometimes driving it like an idiot that it never broke on him for all the miles he put on it. He sold it for a newer WRX (he needed 4 doors, but wanted something fun as a daily driver) whereas with teenage kids I can have 2 doors but need 4 seats in case of something like an impromptu school pickup/dropoff.

I bought the 6 speed manual for the fun of it and the manual has the LS3 Motor with 426 HP. The auto has the L99 motor with only 400 HP AND the shitty motor destroying Displacement on Demand bullshit for mileage (who the fuck does that?). The manual car doesn't have that and actually acts like it is supposed to.

The plus side is the LS3 is still old school small block pushrod V8 technology and parts are everywhere, anyone (including me) can work on them, the 2012 has no nav/touch screen ridiculousness (just a radio with CD, XM, and AUX/iPhone plug in port) and with a cold air intake, a cam and an exhaust, they can get up to a respectable 500 ish HP depending on cam and tune.

I'm holding onto this one, despite that old demented child sniffer trying to make gas 100 bucks a gallon. (old beater truck in the background).

62702

[Faramir2]

I bought a 2012 Chevy Camaro SS at the end of last year because I finally was able to get back into a fun/sorta daily car to supplement my old beater truck and the family car. Paid like 23,000 for it. Last car like this I had was about 25 years ago right out of college when I bought a 1992 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX Turbo with the AWD and the 5 speed. I should never have sold that car... But I digress...

Buddy of mine who still works for an agency near me regrettably sold his 2010 SS Camaro, told me he was coming back from the range one day in his 2010 and got it up to about 140 on some back roads and it was solid. Said the car corners smaller than the size would lead you to believe, and he said that despite sometimes driving it like an idiot that it never broke on him for all the miles he put on it. He sold it for a newer WRX (he needed 4 doors, but wanted something fun as a daily driver) whereas with teenage kids I can have 2 doors but need 4 seats in case of something like an impromptu school pickup/dropoff.

I bought the 6 speed manual for the fun of it and the manual has the LS3 Motor with 426 HP. The auto has the L99 motor with only 400 HP AND the shitty motor destroying Displacement on Demand bullshit for mileage (who the fuck does that?). The manual car doesn't have that and actually acts like it is supposed to.

The plus side is the LS3 is still old school small block pushrod V8 technology and parts are everywhere, anyone (including me) can work on them, the 2012 has no nav/touch screen ridiculousness (just a radio with CD, XM, and AUX/iPhone plug in port) and with a cold air intake, a cam and an exhaust, they can get up to a respectable 500 ish HP depending on cam and tune.

I'm holding onto this one, despite that old demented child sniffer trying to make gas 100 bucks a gallon. (old beater truck in the background).

62702

You know, I didn't really want a Camaro or something like it, but your post makes me rethink that...that sounds like a pretty neat car, I gotta say.

[45Smashemflat]

Gool 'ol Lucas. The Prince of Darkness.

Father of the intermittent wiper…

[Shooter Ready]

Fast cars are like guns-- lots of people drive nice cars, but very few actually use them anywhere close to their limits. I blow by plenty of Porsches in my old Audi A6. My wife wonders why I drive like my hair is on fire, but a man has to do what he has to do. The Audis with the 6 cylinder engines run fast enough, especially in Sport mode. I had 5 warnings in a row before my most recent moving violation. The S4 and RS3/4s have more juice but not really necessary if you don't live in a place where you can't drive fast enough to stretch their legs.

Don't get more car than you can afford. It's not an investment, its an indulgence. There is always another car in your future. Some things are worth spending on, though, if only to enjoy the rewards of hard work.

[62-10]

Lucas was on the JV squad...Marelli was Varsity (1st string). Don't ask me how I know this.

[Shooter Ready]

That second paragraph is sage advice.
.

Thanks for the kind words.

I'm a bargain shopper/value hunter, so the relative performance compared to the S models made it an easy choice for me. Given the context in this thread of a relatively young person looking for a performance car, getting something cost effective and investing other available funds would be a wise choice.

[Gunstore Commando]

On restorations stay away from anything with “Lucas” electronics, they couldn’t fit “lucifer” on the gauge face. When I was a kid my mom had a love of old British cars ( and a couple Italian ones). Pop taught me to cuss restoring and maintaining those.

My Dad literally begged my brother not to buy an English sports car. Bro didn't listen. :biglaugh:

[David Bowman]

Nice Camaro, and looks like you chose a good year. Like you said, they are silly easy to upgrade for more power.
A close friend has one (2014 I think?) with the ZL1 package and a few modifications and tune, last we talked he was up to 670 hp with it. It's pretty quick, but apparently can be tricky to drive aggressively at lower speeds like tight corners because it wants to spin the tires so much.

That ZL1 package is fantastic, and I found one I liked when I was looking for this one, but I was going to have to sell some guns to get enough down payment to get that car into my price range, and guns are only for buying right now; not selling.

[David Bowman]

You know, I didn't really want a Camaro or something like it, but your post makes me rethink that...that sounds like a pretty neat car, I gotta say.


I have seen only 1 in this color (Imperial Blue Metallic) in town, and I don't think it was a popular color. If you find one with a 1LE package, you are basically getting a ZL1 package car minus the supercharger.

I could really go on for awhile, but the 5th generation cars (2010-15) have all the fun things of a pony car without all the "spaceship" interior designs and are a great modern iteration of the old 1st generation 67-69 cars.

[UNO]

What tends to go wrong on VW engines? Definitely not interested in an electric vehicle, for a lot of reasons, though I hear you on the instant torque.

VW has issues with carbon build up, although it's gotten better, walnut blasting is still a thing on their non-dual injection motors. Also the ever-present VW electrical issues with everything that involves any electricity, lol

[UNO]

Ha! I hear that.

I have to say I'd be really tempted by one myself, but much more so if it had AWD. (Which is not in keeping with the Camaro line I'm well aware, I used to be a die hard Chevy guy.) That ZL1 of my bud's is a sweet sweet car, but it'd be absolutely stunning if it had the grip of an AWD car, particularly around here where we see frequent rain 9 months out of the year.

I will only buy AWD vehicles. My first one was a Jeep with HEMI in 2014, and it amazed me how much better AWD was vs. FWD or RWD. I had previously been a RWD fan, but AWD especially when paired with a good torque vectoring diff like in my RDX, is just worlds better in all the ways. Where I live now, we have snow and ice. Ice is the worst. I constantly see RWD vehicles wiping out eating the guardrail. Lifted trucks are the worst, followed by normal trucks. The RWD just faceplants them. I watched one going over an overpass doing 40ish, and he just slammed into the guardrail. Rear snapped around and he ate it. I drove over the overpass with zero issues in my AWD. I have never once used "snow" tires, preferring quality 3PMSF tires instead, and it just...does. AWD is where it's at. IF I were to get a sports car (Can't because of where I live), I would be strongly pulled toward this:
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a38679729/2022-bmw-m240i-xdrive-by-the-numbers/
The ZF8 is a great slushbox, the B58 is madly underrated, and aside from the inevitable VANOS failures, has proven pretty reliable. All in all, this is one of the nicer, lower maintenance AWD sporty vehicles available. Hot hatches like the WRX, Yaris GR, etc. are just shitty buzzboxes IMO, and I don't like them for a daily. Maybe when I was 18, or maybe for a track car, but otherwise, I'll take my performance with a dash of class.

Once you've driven a quality auto, the allure of a manual just isn't there, in my experience. I have a friend with a WRX Sti, and he LOVES manual. Harps on it. Constantly all about the manual. He got into a GLA35 AMG and was all "Manuals are fun but they suck and are outdated", lol! (He later traded it right back and got his STI back because the AMG maintenance was stoopid absurd as I posted above).

[Faramir2]

I will only buy AWD vehicles. My first one was a Jeep with HEMI in 2014, and it amazed me how much better AWD was vs. FWD or RWD. I had previously been a RWD fan, but AWD especially when paired with a good torque vectoring diff like in my RDX, is just worlds better in all the ways. Where I live now, we have snow and ice. Ice is the worst. I constantly see RWD vehicles wiping out eating the guardrail. Lifted trucks are the worst, followed by normal trucks. The RWD just faceplants them. I watched one going over an overpass doing 40ish, and he just slammed into the guardrail. Rear snapped around and he ate it. I drove over the overpass with zero issues in my AWD. I have never once used "snow" tires, preferring quality 3PMSF tires instead, and it just...does. AWD is where it's at. IF I were to get a sports car (Can't because of where I live), I would be strongly pulled toward this:
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a38679729/2022-bmw-m240i-xdrive-by-the-numbers/
The ZF8 is a great slushbox, the B58 is madly underrated, and aside from the inevitable VANOS failures, has proven pretty reliable. All in all, this is one of the nicer, lower maintenance AWD sporty vehicles available. Hot hatches like the WRX, Yaris GR, etc. are just shitty buzzboxes IMO, and I don't like them for a daily. Maybe when I was 18, or maybe for a track car, but otherwise, I'll take my performance with a dash of class.

Once you've driven a quality auto, the allure of a manual just isn't there, in my experience. I have a friend with a WRX Sti, and he LOVES manual. Harps on it. Constantly all about the manual. He got into a GLA35 AMG and was all "Manuals are fun but they suck and are outdated", lol! (He later traded it right back and got his STI back because the AMG maintenance was stoopid absurd as I posted above).

Very little likelihood of serious snow or ice where I am, but occasionally I want to get off of normally-maintained roads; there AWD would be handy (one reason I'm somewhat drawn to the VW Golf R).

I'm one of those inveterate manual transmission lovers. Is the love for auto born mainly of the fact that a really good auto is always quicker and smoother than a human shifter? That seems to be the dominant view. Personally, I love manual because I like doing it myself and simply enjoy the process, even though I know I will never be as quick, smooth, and accurate as an excellently-made machine. To me, it's aesthetic as much as anything else (one reason I like fountain pens and straight razors, putting aside that, when one purchases a good quality pen or razor and maintains it well, those items are simply better).

[ammoboy2]

UNO

You are right the BMW 240s are awesome. The spouse has an AWD 230 and even with less power its handling is great.

[apamburn]

Very little likelihood of serious snow or ice where I am, but occasionally I want to get off of normally-maintained roads; there AWD would be handy (one reason I'm somewhat drawn to the VW Golf R).

I'm one of those inveterate manual transmission lovers. Is the love for auto born mainly of the fact that a really good auto is always quicker and smoother than a human shifter? That seems to be the dominant view. Personally, I love manual because I like doing it myself and simply enjoy the process, even though I know I will never be as quick, smooth, and accurate as an excellently-made machine. To me, it's aesthetic as much as anything else (one reason I like fountain pens and straight razors, putting aside that, when one purchases a good quality pen or razor and maintains it well, those items are simply better).

Ditto on the fountain pens and straights

[Johnny C!]

I will only buy AWD vehicles. My first one was a Jeep with HEMI in 2014, and it amazed me how much better AWD was vs. FWD or RWD. I had previously been a RWD fan, but AWD especially when paired with a good torque vectoring diff like in my RDX, is just worlds better in all the ways. Where I live now, we have snow and ice. Ice is the worst. I constantly see RWD vehicles wiping out eating the guardrail. Lifted trucks are the worst, followed by normal trucks. The RWD just faceplants them. I watched one going over an overpass doing 40ish, and he just slammed into the guardrail. Rear snapped around and he ate it. I drove over the overpass with zero issues in my AWD. I have never once used "snow" tires, preferring quality 3PMSF tires instead, and it just...does. AWD is where it's at. IF I were to get a sports car (Can't because of where I live), I would be strongly pulled toward this:
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a38679729/2022-bmw-m240i-xdrive-by-the-numbers/
The ZF8 is a great slushbox, the B58 is madly underrated, and aside from the inevitable VANOS failures, has proven pretty reliable. All in all, this is one of the nicer, lower maintenance AWD sporty vehicles available. Hot hatches like the WRX, Yaris GR, etc. are just shitty buzzboxes IMO, and I don't like them for a daily. Maybe when I was 18, or maybe for a track car, but otherwise, I'll take my performance with a dash of class.

Once you've driven a quality auto, the allure of a manual just isn't there, in my experience. I have a friend with a WRX Sti, and he LOVES manual. Harps on it. Constantly all about the manual. He got into a GLA35 AMG and was all "Manuals are fun but they suck and are outdated", lol! (He later traded it right back and got his STI back because the AMG maintenance was stoopid absurd as I posted above).

I concur about the AWD comments. My wagon is a 4matic.
Cornering on dry pavement is unbelievable. I won't intentionally
take it out in snow because of low ground clearance, & we have
2 Jeeps & a tagged SXS, but I have no doubt I could get home
if I got caught out in an unexpected snowfall.

We live in the mountains, so the only place I get to stretch it's
legs on the top end is on the interstate, (but passing a left lane
camper or other similar idiot is always a lesson in moderation)
but I am not really interested in speeding tickets anymore.
I have plenty of twisty, climbing roads where I can really get
lost in what that car is capable of, without breaking to many
laws.

[Faramir2]

I concur about the AWD comments. My wagon is a 4matic.
Cornering on dry pavement is unbelievable. I won't intentionally
take it out in snow because of low ground clearance, & we have
2 Jeeps & a tagged SXS, but I have no doubt I could get home
if I got caught out in an unexpected snowfall.

We live in the mountains, so the only place I get to stretch it's
legs on the top end is on the interstate, (but passing a left lane
camper or other similar idiot is always a lesson in moderation)
but I am not really interested in speeding tickets anymore.
I have plenty of twisty, climbing roads where I can really get
lost in what that car is capable of, without breaking to many
laws.

Another good plus of AWD—surprise poor conditions are less of an issue. A number of years ago I took my Civic to Michigan in December for a friend's wedding, then into Minnesota. The FWD did fine in the snow, once I learned how to manage it. But driving my sister's CR-V on a different snowy day in TN was a lot easier with the AWD.

[jesselp]

I'm one of those inveterate manual transmission lovers. Is the love for auto born mainly of the fact that a really good auto is always quicker and smoother than a human shifter? That seems to be the dominant view. Personally, I love manual because I like doing it myself and simply enjoy the process, even though I know I will never be as quick, smooth, and accurate as an excellently-made machine. To me, it's aesthetic as much as anything else (one reason I like fountain pens and straight razors, putting aside that, when one purchases a good quality pen or razor and maintains it well, those items are simply better).

I love a manual transmission and the connection it gives me to the vehicle. I own manuals, and they always put a smile on my face.

I'll say two things about a modern automatic (specifically, the Porsche PDK which I have experience with, but I'm sure others are similar) 1) They are faster, and they are marvels of modern engineering. 2) My wife can drive them. If I go on a weekend away with my wife in one of the manual cars, I'm doing all the driving. I need to be careful of my drinking, sleeping, and health. If I get a migraine or sprain my ankle on a hike, we're stuck. With an auto, she can drive us home, and that is worth the slightly diminished driving experience when I'm using the car more as a "grand tour" type of vehicle than an all out "sports car."

[Faramir2]

I love a manual transmission and the connection it gives me to the vehicle. I own manuals, and they always put a smile on my face.

I'll say two things about a modern automatic (specifically, the Porsche PDK which I have experience with, but I'm sure others are similar) 1) They are faster, and they are marvels of modern engineering. 2) My wife can drive them. If I go on a weekend away with my wife in one of the manual cars, I'm doing all the driving. I need to be careful of my drinking, sleeping, and health. If I get a migraine or sprain my ankle on a hike, we're stuck. With an auto, she can drive us home, and that is worth the slightly diminished driving experience when I'm using the car more as a "grand tour" type of vehicle than an all out "sports car."

Very good point about the wife being able to drive. My wife could manage to drive my current stick shift, but she's not greatly confident on it and is somewhat rough. Her car is an automatic, but we're working on getting her up to speed on stick. Still, there's something to be said about auto being easier for others to drive.

[rcpylon]

To scratch that itch and meet some other needs I went with the Ford Explorer ST last go around. 400 hp, AWD, flappy paddles or full auto transmission, 3 rows of seats, very quiet ride unless you put it in sport mode. I did a 5.3/60 one day and was very impressed with that for a mid sized suv.

I also took a ride with a friend in his challenger, its a wide body hot one (yellowjacket maybe). Best i remember its a 3 sec/60 car. that thing not only put me in the seat i seriously thought i was going thru the seat!.

The modern stuff blows anything away from not too many years ago.

[ammoboy2]

50s era vettes were only 12 sec 0-60 cars now under 3

[UNO]

Another good plus of AWD—surprise poor conditions are less of an issue. A number of years ago I took my Civic to Michigan in December for a friend's wedding, then into Minnesota. The FWD did fine in the snow, once I learned how to manage it. But driving my sister's CR-V on a different snowy day in TN was a lot easier with the AWD.

Or just gravel at the juncture of a side and main street in town.

That said, I love awd for performance reasons, too. I was hammering the corners in my RDX, and it will push 70% of the torque to the rear tires, and 100% of that left or right. It literslly felt like the 4000# suv was rotating through the APEX. Marketing hype transited directly to the real world.

[UNO]

To scratch that itch and meet some other needs I went with the Ford Explorer ST last go around. 400 hp, AWD, flappy paddles or full auto transmission, 3 rows of seats, very quiet ride unless you put it in sport mode. I did a 5.3/60 one day and was very impressed with that for a mid sized suv.

I also took a ride with a friend in his challenger, its a wide body hot one (yellowjacket maybe). Best i remember its a 3 sec/60 car. that thing not only put me in the seat i seriously thought i was going thru the seat!.

The modern stuff blows anything away from not too many years ago.

I considered the Explorer ST as well. How did you measure your 5.3 to 60? Dragy, or what? Those things move, but I've never had a chance t o run one in anything I've ever driven. Love how they look!

[rcpylon]

I considered the Explorer ST as well. How did you measure your 5.3 to 60? Dragy, or what? Those things move, but I've never had a chance t o run one in anything I've ever driven. Love how they look!

I got one of the ODBLink MX+ from the A to Z store. and my memory was a little incorrect. I did a 5.7/60. I got the link as an OBD scanner and it also let me modify some of the settings on my Ford. It has some performance software as well that generated the data below.


Date: 10/8/2020 5:41:46 PM

VIN: 1FM5K8GC7LGA57771
Manufacturer: Ford
Model: Explorer
Option: 3.0L EcoBoost
Year: 2020


Results





Distance
Time
Speed


60 ft
2.19 sec
29.8 MPH


330 ft
6.00 sec
62.1 MPH


1/8 mi
9.08 sec
78.3 MPH


1000 ft
11.82 sec
89.5 MPH


1/4 mi
14.21 sec
98.2 MPH





Speed Splits





Speed
Time


0-10 MPH
0.73 sec


0-20 MPH
1.48 sec


0-30 MPH
2.19 sec


0-40 MPH
3.29 sec


0-50 MPH
4.21 sec


0-60 MPH
5.71 sec


0-70 MPH
7.21 sec


0-80 MPH
9.27 sec


0-90 MPH
11.82 sec

[UNO]

I got one of the ODBLink MX+ from the A to Z store. and my memory was a little incorrect. I did a 5.7/60. I got the link as an OBD scanner and it also let me modify some of the settings on my Ford. It has some performance software as well that generated the data below.


Date: 10/8/2020 5:41:46 PM

VIN: 1FM5K8GC7LGA57771
Manufacturer: Ford
Model: Explorer
Option: 3.0L EcoBoost
Year: 2020


Results





Distance
Time
Speed


60 ft
2.19 sec
29.8 MPH


330 ft
6.00 sec
62.1 MPH


1/8 mi
9.08 sec
78.3 MPH


1000 ft
11.82 sec
89.5 MPH


1/4 mi
14.21 sec
98.2 MPH





Speed Splits





Speed
Time


0-10 MPH
0.73 sec


0-20 MPH
1.48 sec


0-30 MPH
2.19 sec


0-40 MPH
3.29 sec


0-50 MPH
4.21 sec


0-60 MPH
5.71 sec


0-70 MPH
7.21 sec


0-80 MPH
9.27 sec


0-90 MPH
11.82 sec





Awesome! That 60ft slaps for an suv!
I am hoping my dragy arrives today. Im curious what my rdx do.

[Faramir2]

Or just gravel at the juncture of a side and main street in town.

That said, I love awd for performance reasons, too. I was hammering the corners in my RDX, and it will push 70% of the torque to the rear tires, and 100% of that left or right. It literslly felt like the 4000# suv was rotating through the APEX. Marketing hype transited directly to the real world.

Sounds like an AWD would be a great choice for a future vehicle, on all counts.

[David Bowman]

I will only buy AWD vehicles. My first one was a Jeep with HEMI in 2014, and it amazed me how much better AWD was vs. FWD or RWD. I had previously been a RWD fan, but AWD especially when paired with a good torque vectoring diff like in my RDX, is just worlds better in all the ways. Where I live now, we have snow and ice. Ice is the worst. I constantly see RWD vehicles wiping out eating the guardrail. Lifted trucks are the worst, followed by normal trucks. The RWD just faceplants them. I watched one going over an overpass doing 40ish, and he just slammed into the guardrail. Rear snapped around and he ate it. I drove over the overpass with zero issues in my AWD. I have never once used "snow" tires, preferring quality 3PMSF tires instead, and it just...does. AWD is where it's at. IF I were to get a sports car (Can't because of where I live), I would be strongly pulled toward this:
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a38679729/2022-bmw-m240i-xdrive-by-the-numbers/
The ZF8 is a great slushbox, the B58 is madly underrated, and aside from the inevitable VANOS failures, has proven pretty reliable. All in all, this is one of the nicer, lower maintenance AWD sporty vehicles available. Hot hatches like the WRX, Yaris GR, etc. are just shitty buzzboxes IMO, and I don't like them for a daily. Maybe when I was 18, or maybe for a track car, but otherwise, I'll take my performance with a dash of class.

Once you've driven a quality auto, the allure of a manual just isn't there, in my experience. I have a friend with a WRX Sti, and he LOVES manual. Harps on it. Constantly all about the manual. He got into a GLA35 AMG and was all "Manuals are fun but they suck and are outdated", lol! (He later traded it right back and got his STI back because the AMG maintenance was stoopid absurd as I posted above).


I loved my AWD Mitsubishi Eclipse. That thing was glued to the road and the pick up off the line was reasonable and muted until the turbo spooled up, and then I was glad to have the AWD. It was great in the wet and when I put the snow tires on it, there were no issues getting around in the snow. I am missing that car all over again.

My buddy who sold his Camaro for the WRX does rave about the AWD and how it handles.

[Winchester67]

Modern cars are so capable it is hard to really use their performance potential. Which is why I have more fun driving a slow car fast as opposed to a fast car slow. So for me, the cars of my youth get the nod for fun. Muscle cars, convertible of course are a great choice. British Sports Cars are fun, but require more work to own. As a young man I did the whole MG, Triumph, Austin Healey, Jaguar, Lotus progression and would not trade the experience, but as I got older I returned to my roots (first car was a 1966 Ford Mustang) and got into Muscle Cars because they were so much easier to own...lot less wrenching. Today, my fun car is a Backdraft Cobra. It has a 345 Horse Ford Small Block and a Tremec 5 speed transmission. Factory built in South Africa. So somewhat modern, but vintage handling. Still enough horsepower to pull a Boy Scout off your Granny, but a new Mustang or Corvette would leave it in the dust in terms of real speed you can put to the ground.62735

[Jack Rumbaugh]

I've been a car guy most of my life. My current ride is a 2018 Kis Stinger GT2 3.3l V6 twin turbo, 380 ish HP. It's plenty quick and I can get it into the 11s with minimal investment. I would have killed for a 12 second car back when I was elbow deep in muscle cars, and here I bought one off the showroom floor.
62736

[Winchester67]

Course, the true Classics are fun too. I used to have a 1962 Corvette with a 340 horse 327 and a four speed with 4.11 gears. It was just like the Beach Boys sang about; you could get rubber in all four gears. But part of that was the 1950's truck based suspension. Old cars are fun, but they are not the best choice for serious speed. They are fun speed instead. Kinda like choosing a revolver for carry today instead of an RMR Glock! (yeah, that is also my Camaro and my 68 Suicide Door Thunderbird in the background. Hey, I was a couple years out of college, was 22 years old, had just bought my first house and drove old cars instead of payments on a new car. Good times indeed.) 62737

[Winchester67]

Here is a shot of the inside of the 62 Vette. No power steering, no power brakes, no A/C, no cruise control, AM Radio...modern cars are a lot easier to live with day to day. (notice the 1967 Fastback Mustang in the garage. My neighbors thought I was a car dealer!)

[Faramir2]

Here is a shot of the inside of the 62 Vette. No power steering, no power brakes, no A/C, no cruise control, AM Radio...modern cars are a lot easier to live with day to day. (notice the 1967 Fastback Mustang in the garage. My neighbors thought I was a car dealer!)

That'd be hecka fun to drive...on nice days on the weekends. Definitely not a true daily driver so far as comfort goes. Something about that analog driving experience has its charms, though.

[Winchester67]

Agreed. For a guy starting out with a fun car that is still practical enough to take on weekend trips a newer Corvette is tough to beat. Say 5-8 years old. Still capable of putting your drivers license in jeopardy, but at the end of the day it is still just a Chevy. Heck between here and the Lake of the Ozarks there are like three Chevy dealers and it is not even 100 miles! With that kind of support, a guy could own an Italian car!!!!! But there are a ton of used Vette's out there that are the dream car of a lot of guys and they babied them. Then after a few years, they sell them off...those are the ones to find. But with the top down and the growl of a V-8...if that is not buying back my youth it at least rents it for the day!

[Crusader8207]

So... I just got a call from the Audi dealer. Apparently they can not give me a build date on the A4. The wiring harnesses are made in the Ukraine....

Time to drop back and punt....