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Rustwins88
01-12-2017, 11:19 AM
I've been thinking more about the Glock PDW and how to utilize it to attain maximum effectiveness. I understand the myriad of benefits this system brings to the table - portability, familiar interface, mags, etc...

However, I am inquiring as to which path I should take, considering that the addition of a thumb safety is paramount with this PDW.

1) Dedicated PDW - Set it up and leave it as is. Stock stays on 24/7. Fold and forget, as it were.

2) Convertible PDW - I see this as a huge advantage to this system. Remove the stock adapter from time to time for a tier 1 edc. But what about the thumb safety? Is it easily removable? I feel that having only one (holstered edc) Glock with a thumb safety would interrupt the standard manual of arms. My muscle memory with Glock would be a bit jumbled considering I've got multiple Glocks that will never have a manual safety. I can train to use the safety when it's in PDW mode but I feel it would be unwise to start treating a holstered Glock like a 1911. I think I can skip the extended mag catch because I'll be running it as a lefty and as such, I should be able to use my middle finger for the mag release. If the thumb safety is too inconvenient to replace and this project becomes a dedicated PDW, extended mag release will be added. Is there an ambi thumb safety available?

3) Ultra Convertible PDW - Aside from SHTF ammo consideration, is there a distinct advantage to getting a G22 and then converting it to 9mm and .357 sig? I like the idea of ultimate versatility but I can't see too much practical use outside of longer range shots with .357 sig. If this path is chosen and 9mm becomes the primary focus of this Convertible, is it wise to swap uppers or consign myself to a conversion bbl?

Gabriel Suarez
01-12-2017, 11:31 AM
Mine


I've been thinking more about the Glock PDW and how to utilize it to attain maximum effectiveness. I understand the myriad of benefits this system brings to the table - portability, familiar interface, mags, etc...

However, I am inquiring as to which path I should take, considering that the addition of a thumb safety is paramount with this PDW.

1) Dedicated PDW - Set it up and leave it as is. Stock stays on 24/7. Fold and forget, as it were.

This what I have done. Glocks are quite affordable. In fact, if someone cannot buy two Glocks I would ask them why they are spending so much time on an internet forum. You can optimize the platform for the use of the stock. Simpler and efficient.


2) Convertible PDW - I see this as a huge advantage to this system. Remove the stock adapter from time to time for a tier 1 edc. But what about the thumb safety? Is it easily removable? I feel that having only one (holstered edc) Glock with a thumb safety would interrupt the standard manual of arms. My muscle memory with Glock would be a bit jumbled considering I've got multiple Glocks that will never have a manual safety. I can train to use the safety when it's in PDW mode but I feel it would be unwise to start treating a holstered Glock like a 1911. I think I can skip the extended mag catch because I'll be running it as a lefty and as such, I should be able to use my middle finger for the mag release. If the thumb safety is too inconvenient to replace and this project becomes a dedicated PDW, extended mag release will be added. Is there an ambi thumb safety available?

You are making a huge compromise with this as a stock Glock will not be as optimal for PDW and a PDW will not be optimal for holster carry.

3) Ultra Convertible PDW - Aside from SHTF ammo consideration, is there a distinct advantage to getting a G22 and then converting it to 9mm and .357 sig? I like the idea of ultimate versatility but I can't see too much practical use outside of longer range shots with .357 sig. If this path is chosen and 9mm becomes the primary focus of this Convertible, is it wise to swap uppers or consign myself to a conversion bbl?

Conversion barrels are stupid, do not work reliably and I would never use one for a fighting weapon. Add to that that majority are Lone Wolf sewer pipes and you have my opinion on conversion barrels. If you want to convert back and forth, get an entire upper unit.

DogDoc
01-12-2017, 12:34 PM
I opted for two separate frames. I once had a Glock with an extended mag release and hated it. I do see the benefit on the PDW though. I see the benefit of the safety as well but wouldn't want it on a carry gun (had one of those once too and didn't like it).

So, I have a regular Gen 3 G17 frame with an extended mag release attached to the Endo/KAK which just stays that way. The second frame is a G17 frame cut to G19 grip length and shaped and stippled.

A single SI RMR slide is shared between the two frames. Each frame is optimized for its intended role. I have a number of Glocks and a couple of other PDWs but only one G17. Figured it might as well be able to serve in two roles.

Rustwins88
01-12-2017, 12:49 PM
Thanks for your insight Gabe.

Perhaps my verbiage is a bit vague and/or convoluted. I plan on doing all the upgrades. TSD slide, bbl, red dot etc. $500 stock Glocks are affordable, but Tier 1 Glocks not so much. I understand the value but it'll be awhile before I can have 2 (or more) TSD Glocks, hence my propensity towards a "Swiss army knife" approach. I've grown to understand that this "Swiss army knife" approach is usually a combination of compromises, yet I constantly find myself dwelling on possibilities. If/when I get two TSD G17s, the only difference will be in the thumb safety. It'd be very versatile if I could just remove the safety and stock and transform it back to an EDC when needed, while I save up for another edc dedicated TSD Glock, which might be a 17k or a 19. I'm also saving up to GTFO of the city, so funds are limited.

I think most would suggest getting my edc squared away and doing the pdw when I can. This makes perfect sense, but my edc only gets carried after work and on the weekends. I really like the idea of a truck gun backup to my npe 43 while I'm at work which is why I am prioritizing the PDW over a TSD holster edc G17. I do landscaping so the truck is usually pretty damn close and a pdw Glock would fit perfectly in my bag. I do tend to overthink things on occasion, which is why I am inquiring on my favorite forum. It'd be nigh on worthless to inquire elsewhere.

I figured the upper swap is the way to go. LW sewer pipes lol.

Ted Demosthenes
01-12-2017, 12:54 PM
What is the driver behind your decision to install a thumb safety on your Glock?

Rustwins88
01-12-2017, 01:04 PM
Sometimes the answer is too obvious! Different frames...how did I not consider this previously? Overthinking is a gift and a curse lol.

It takes 2 seconds to swap an upper! Removing a thumb safety and stock might not. Brilliant.

G17k frame for edc and a regular G17 frame with safety for PDW. Then get another TSD upper when I can afford one, grab a charging handle for the PDW and I'm set!

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your input.

DogDoc
01-12-2017, 01:05 PM
Thanks for your insight Gabe.

Perhaps my verbiage is a bit vague and/or convoluted. I plan on doing all the upgrades. TSD slide, bbl, red dot etc. $500 stock Glocks are affordable, but Tier 1 Glocks not so much. I understand the value but it'll be awhile before I can have 2 (or more) TSD Glocks, hence my propensity towards a "Swiss army knife" approach.

You can pick up a second frame pretty cheap if money is tight. Optimize each for its role and share the SI slide. Gabe often has them.

Paper Shredder
01-12-2017, 01:11 PM
Sometimes the answer is too obvious! Different frames...how did I not consider this previously? Overthinking is a gift and a curse lol.

It takes 2 seconds to swap an upper! Removing a thumb safety and stock might not. Brilliant.

G17k frame for edc and a regular G17 frame with safety for PDW. Then get another TSD upper when I can afford one, grab a charging handle for the PDW and I'm set!

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your input.

I'm there too... but my EDC is a G19. The same methods apply though.

I wonder if I can put a G19 slide on a g17?

Rustwins88
01-12-2017, 01:11 PM
Ted, when it's on a sling it's a whole different animal. Thumb safety allows it to be ran like an mp5, etc. Gabe is evolving this system and has found a thumb safety to be the best way to achieve this result. I like the idea of a flashlight that has a folding mechanism that covers the triggerguard and can fold forward and be used as a foregrip, but it only exists in my imagination lol, and unfortunately foregrips are banned on any firearm that has an OAL below 26", IIRC.

Gabe has some videos on the topic in this sub forum.

Rustwins88
01-12-2017, 01:16 PM
I'm there too... but my EDC is a G19. The same methods apply though.

I wonder if I can put a G19 slide on a g17?

Unfortunately the only uppers that can be swapped on any 9mm Glock frame is 17 and 34 uppers on a 17/34 frame. You can put a G19 bbl in a 26, but that's about it.

At some point I figure ENDO will make a G19 model, but there's no telling when. However, you can modify the stock to fit your 19 if you are inclined.

GemJedi
01-12-2017, 08:18 PM
51173

End of day, PDW assembled. (See extended magazine release). I installed it myself so you can too. I am going back and forth about the dedicated PDW versus disassembled when out of home. The issue is not about buying a second G17, I would if that was it.

Carrying around the dedicated PDW in a bag in addition to my briefcase stands out and is cumbersome. I have been doing it between home, car, and office for a month but the AIWB carry always remains the best primary in any reactive situation. I was considering keeping a few Endo/Blades around, in glovebox, at home and office for assembly. I am also testing carrying dissasembled Endo/Blade in my regular briefcase which easily goes with me into the coffee shop.

I just wonder if outside the home, the on body 17 drawn for reactive and transitioned to PDW where it may become proactive, is more fluid than having the assembled PDW in the bag and, assuming I have the PDW available, drawing the carry gun and then transitioning to a second gun from the bag (which is a two handed operation). I am thinking that holding the drawn on-body gun can be done while grabbing an available PDW with the off hand, then assembled. Any thoughts appreciated.

Inside the home is different and I definitely see the benefit of having a dedicated PDW with light.

Ted Demosthenes
01-12-2017, 08:29 PM
Ted, when it's on a sling it's a whole different animal. Thumb safety allows it to be ran like an mp5, etc. Gabe is evolving this system and has found a thumb safety to be the best way to achieve this result. I like the idea of a flashlight that has a folding mechanism that covers the triggerguard and can fold forward and be used as a foregrip, but it only exists in my imagination lol, and unfortunately foregrips are banned on any firearm that has an OAL below 26", IIRC.

Gabe has some videos on the topic in this sub forum.

Thanks; just curious how you (and others) are implementing each weapon system choice.

My PDW is a 34 with RMR06 on SI slide. It too will get MR and TS mod.

USMC1302Colt
01-14-2017, 12:02 AM
If you're going to assemble a Glock PDW, then dedicate that weapon for that purpose in my mind.

MesserMan
01-14-2017, 02:04 AM
If you can't afford to build a dedicated PDW frame all at once, do it one part at a time as funds become available. First, buy a second frame and permanently attach the PDW kit to it, and keep it by your bedside. Then, buy and install the thumb safety when you can afford it. After that, add whatever parts you desire in any order you desire. Before long, you'll have your PDW frame optimized for that role. At the end of the day, when you take off your pants, just move the slide of your carry gun over to the PDW frame. The next morning, move it back to the carry gun. At some point, I would look at getting a second, dedicated upper for the PDW frame. Probably a G34 slide with threaded match barrel and charging handle (all Suarez parts), and 1moa RMR.