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View Full Version : RONI GLOCK "BRACE"



Paper Shredder
08-24-2016, 07:34 AM
Before this thread runs away, let me preface by the Suarez package is pretty much the minimalistic version of this concept. I have yet to purchase and use one so I'm not advocating one over the other. I'm just offering an academic topic on a rainy Georgia morning.

Certainly the value proposition is not there... $500 vs $100 or there abouts. I'd say the only benefit is that the RONI can mount larger carbine optics, but the discussion on rifle misidentification in a TASI situation by LE is still applicable here.

I just saw this and wondered how much longer the ATF will allow the brace and basically "look the other way".

ETA: I think companies like Sig probably have a serious lobby with the ATF to protect the arm brace... but wonder if smaller shops like RONI and KAK are only succeeding by the good graces of SIG?

49377

ShopMonkey
08-24-2016, 08:44 AM
in all honesty, i want this one
https://usa.caagearup.com/micro-roni-stabilizer

Greg Nichols
08-24-2016, 09:09 AM
in all honesty, i want this one
https://usa.caagearup.com/micro-roni-stabilizer

This looks a lot more user friendly, tho IDK what the price point is. That being said, unless I had a G17 with an 8+" barrel I wouldn't really have a use for this at all

DogDoc
08-24-2016, 09:21 AM
I don't know about the Roni but I had the SIG ACP enclosure. It was stupid heavy and a real PITA to get the Glock in our out of it. The Endo PDW is VASTLY better in all respects IMO.

Eric Tull
08-24-2016, 09:24 AM
I have trouble seeing a good use for this. It's heavier and larger than an SI Glock PDW, but not as effective ballistically as an M4 pistol.

Paper Shredder
08-24-2016, 09:25 AM
This looks a lot more user friendly, tho IDK what the price point is. That being said, unless I had a G17 with an 8+" barrel I wouldn't really have a use for this at all

Yeah I'm thinking that too. Even with the Suarez PDW kit I'm thinking I would want a longer barrel.

I do however like the fact that my chopped G17 is compatible here.

DopeForWind
08-24-2016, 10:00 AM
I have trouble seeing a good use for this. It's heavier and larger than an SI Glock PDW, but not as effective ballistically as an M4 pistol.

That's what I'm thinking. Don't fix what ain't broke.

Brent Yamamoto
08-24-2016, 10:09 AM
As with all things, if a guy wants it he should just get it.

I like SMGs for instance. They are functional of course, but mostly I just like them because they are cool. But I recognize that they don't do anything that the Glock PDW won't. (Ok I can buttstroke someone with my Uzi but I won't say that makes it better than a Glock PDW.)

I've looked at the various Glock enclosure units and I'm just not seeing the draw. More weight, more money, more drama, harder to conceal, and less reliability. I'd rather have an MP5 in that case.

But to each his own. I agree with Greg, if one goes this route he might as well get a much longer barrel.

Gabriel Suarez
08-24-2016, 10:15 AM
So please someone tell me, other that magazines (which are not that big a deal now), why this Israeli thing instead of any other Semi Auto SMG like an MPX, An EVO, etc?
I'm not feeling it.

baker
08-24-2016, 10:17 AM
If my Glocks didn't already have red dots mounted I might consider it. Unfortunately, my 17's are Gen4 and my 21 is sf, so I can't go the other pdw route without buying another gun or modifying the stock adapter.

Greg Nichols
08-24-2016, 10:18 AM
^^^^ That's a good point

After dropping $550 on a Glock and another $500 on this thing you could have bought an SMG.

Yondering
08-24-2016, 11:16 AM
If my Glocks didn't already have red dots mounted I might consider it. Unfortunately, my 17's are Gen4 and my 21 is sf, so I can't go the other pdw route without buying another gun or modifying the stock adapter.

Fitting the 21SF is a pain, but making an Endo fit a gen4 G17 is pretty simple and easy to do; don't let that stop you from getting one.

Brent Yamamoto
08-24-2016, 11:31 AM
Fitting the 21SF is a pain, but making an Endo fit a gen4 G17 is pretty simple and easy to do; don't let that stop you from getting one.

This.

I see no upside to these bolt on units. If I want something the size of an SMG...it would be better to get a real SMG. Not to mention that reliability has been questionable.

Easy button: Buy a Gen 3 Glock and mill it for an RMR. Buy the PDW brace. Even with the RMR I think you're still less than the price of an MPX (which would still need an optic!). The Glock can be a dedicated PDW but you always have the option to remove the brace and convert it back to an EDC pistol.

That's a lot of utility for a reasonable investment. It's proven, it's capable, it's solid.

I'd rather put $500 towards another RMR than this Roni unit.

baker
08-24-2016, 11:37 AM
Fitting the 21SF is a pain, but making an Endo fit a gen4 G17 is pretty simple and easy to do; don't let that stop you from getting one.

Thanks, I will check it out.

Greg Nichols
08-24-2016, 11:39 AM
It's like Groundhog Day, seems like threads keep coming back around and the same determination is reached about every 6 months or so.

WarGoat
08-24-2016, 01:30 PM
It's like Groundhog Day, seems like threads keep coming back around and the same determination is reached about every 6 months or so.

Please, please everyone -- go read my reviews of the enclosures. Anything that attaches to the Glock rail is going to have problems. You will have more problems with a Gen4, or a G19 compared to a G17 or large-framed Glock in "heavier" calibers.

When I first started my research there weren't many options for braced / shoulder-fired weapons that accepted Glock magazines. Now there are A TON of far better options, including the ENDO / SI configuration for those unwilling / legally unable to do other vSBR options.

Paper Shredder
08-24-2016, 05:13 PM
This.

I see no upside to these bolt on units. If I want something the size of an SMG...it would be better to get a real SMG. Not to mention that reliability has been questionable.

Easy button: Buy a Gen 3 Glock and mill it for an RMR. Buy the PDW brace. Even with the RMR I think you're still less than the price of an MPX (which would still need an optic!). The Glock can be a dedicated PDW but you always have the option to remove the brace and convert it back to an EDC pistol.

That's a lot of utility for a reasonable investment. It's proven, it's capable, it's solid.

I'd rather put $500 towards another RMR than this Roni unit.

Yeah I posted this with the intent of the academic discussion. The end result is definitive only this round in the fact that the Endo Suarez Package exists now vs before.

Roni:

Pro:
- able to mount rifle optics.

Cons (outside of common cons with Endo):

- too bulky
- malfunctions
- heavy
- looks like a rifle but performs like a pistol
- $1100 all in

Suarez Glock PDW:

Pros:

- compact / slim
- light weight
- concealable
- removes pistol easily (more so than Roni)
- $650 all in... Could be SIV317 for $1000

Cons:
- I'm reaching but maybe durability

So pure pro vs con analysis makes Suarez Glock PDW the winner for the TASI PDW role in pistol caliber.

Looks like I'm logging back into OST....

GemJedi
08-24-2016, 06:36 PM
It looks like they put a charging handle on the right side, but if your right hand is inside the brace you have to reach over to charge it.

Also, I took my purpose built SI V3 G17 RMR'd PDW to the range and shot it as designed. It really does stabilize the gun better. I have doubts that you could easily shoot the Roni or the Sig brace as designed because the brace aligns the gun to one arm and i think you would have to contort to an unusual position to get a sight alignment. Having the blade to the inside of the wrist on the PDW makes it more usable as designed, which I think you have to do to shake out the system before relying on it.

LawDog
08-24-2016, 09:47 PM
The benefit to the RONI is having a "safety." It may not be a real safety, but that trigger guard cover functions pretty well. That said, it fails in every other regard.

My brother has run a RONI a bit. I recently picked up a couple of Endos, and plan to send one of them to him. If he runs it head-to-head with the RONI, I'll suggest that he post his experiences here. I've only run the RONI dry, but it felt horrible in virtually every way.

I suppose at some point I'll have to get an SMG. They are cool. But I've been on an AR SBR and suppressor binge this last year. I'm going to have to let the checkbook cool off for a while before I shop for any new toys. Maybe MPX magazines will be affordable by then.

EDELWEISS
08-25-2016, 07:26 AM
I have all the components for a Glock PDW. Ive tried it but I'm not completely sold on where it fits in the armory. I Think its best defined as a Stocked Pistol EXCEPT it seems too BIG for as a Stocked Pistol. I keep saying the answer will come when we stop using the AR buffer tube AND come up with a simple folding device that allows use as a "pistol" when folded.--but those are just sketches on napkins.

We have the Glock PDW now; so the question really is: What is the job? AND Is it the best tool for the job?

As a Pistol PLUS or maybe a Rifle MINUS, its big; but its lightweight--both very positive and very negative issues for carry / use. I'm NOT a fan of the enclosures. I wanted to be; especially the SIG version; but I just couldn't make the leap, especially when there were so many good "real" SMG variants available. For those who are fixated on using redundant pistol/SMG (Glock) mags, there are some options. I'm currently carrying a QC10-AR dedicated Glock mag lower. Mine has a 5 inch barrel with a Law Tac folder. YES its heavier than a Glock PDW; but it packs smaller although thicker than a non folding Glock PDW. It has the advantage of a real safety and all the benefits of a AR. It also has a better feel to me. It feels like a SMG. Mine is set up as a modern MP5K-PDW; there are other UPPER options (barrel length and calibers).

The Glock PDW is $$$ friendly, even with a RMR, compared to other SMGs The price difference between a Glock PDW and a AR 9mm is close--BUT again what are you getting AND loosing from a AR9mm VS a Glock PDW? They AREN'T the same. Enclosures seem like poor attempts to make a SMG and terrible attempts at a small PDW.

GemJedi
08-25-2016, 01:48 PM
I parked in a Joliet public garage today, defending a deposition at the court reporter's office. An armed hostage situation developed (http://wgntv.com/2016/08/25/swat-responds-to-standoff-situation-near-harrahs-casino-in-joliet/) a block away from where we were across from the county courthouse, at the riverboat casino parking lot. I was already at the office when we heard they shut down the whole area (including the garage I parked in) and went about our business. I had my RMR'd Glock 26 in my briefcase along with an extra 17 magazine, and I was pretty glad about that.

If I was perhaps still in my car when this unfolded, I would be glad to have my 17 PDW in the car for longer distance shooting if I got locked in the garage with the area shut down. So to answer Edelweiss, I see the PDW more as a rifle minus, except it has attributes like small form and simple deployment that makes it better than a rifle, and unlike a rifle, I can legally keep the PDW loaded in the car under my concealed carry license.

The only flaw to this is that I did not have the PDW with me today because I am still working on getting a lock for the case in the car. But I had my 26, and because of Warrior Talk I also had a knife.

Gabriel Suarez
08-25-2016, 03:56 PM
Once my stamp comes back I will do a video that will not only be reviled by all makers of modern 9mm SMGs (MP5, MPX, Evo, whathaveyou)but will also make these RONNIE things look like fat Israeli Glock Burritos.

Patrick K
08-25-2016, 03:56 PM
On paper it seems like a good idea, but in application, too many moving parts and boy are they uglyyyyyy.

Brent Yamamoto
08-25-2016, 04:22 PM
Makes me want to file a stamp for mine. Not only is the PDW THE easy button for this application in 9mm, but it's also the easy button with other calibers if that's what you're into.

With the long barrel on mine, I basically have a semi auto 357 mag. I know the MPX is supposed to come in 357 sig buy it's still not even available as far as I know.

LawDog
08-25-2016, 04:26 PM
Once my stamp comes back I will do a video that will not only be reviled by all makers of modern 9mm SMGs (MP5, MPX, Evo, whathaveyou)but will also make these RONNIE things look like fat Israeli Glock Burritos.How do you plan to engrave the Glock?

baker
08-25-2016, 05:07 PM
Is it an SBR or Any Other Weapon?

Yondering
08-25-2016, 06:15 PM
How do you plan to engrave the Glock?

Some people engrave the bottom of the trigger guard, some use the bottom of a grip panel. The engraving requirements are less than for a suppressor, so that helps.

baker - a pistol with a stock is an SBR. A pistol with a foregrip is an AOW, no stock allowed.

A foregrip is allowed on an SBR though, so the only advantage in going AOW with a Form 1 is state legal issues where you can't own an SBR.

Yondering
08-25-2016, 06:17 PM
Makes me want to file a stamp for mine. Not only is the PDW THE easy button for this application in 9mm, but it's also the easy button with other calibers if that's what you're into.

With the long barrel on mine, I basically have a semi auto 357 mag. I know the MPX is supposed to come in 357 sig buy it's still not even available as far as I know.

You and me both. It would give the MT more utility as well, although we both agree that's a little outdated now.

Brent Yamamoto
08-25-2016, 06:44 PM
The MT is dated...but it's in the inventory already and I'm still attached to it because we developed it together. And I still like that 11" barrell.

I'm going to put a brace on it and see how it performs. It was demoted to second string but I have created a new role for it.

bassbones
08-25-2016, 06:50 PM
Im no expert, but I think the problem with these clams (besides the ugly/too big/heavy) is that the gun is locked in by the rail. Hanging a light off it won't stop it from flexing during recoil, but having the whole gun locked in causes malfunctions. The ENDO is the way to go.

JB

WarGoat
08-26-2016, 05:28 AM
Im no expert, but I think the problem with these clams (besides the ugly/too big/heavy) is that the gun is locked in by the rail. Hanging a light off it won't stop it from flexing during recoil, but having the whole gun locked in causes malfunctions. The ENDO is the way to go.

JB

Yes, this is the universal weakness with all of these enclosures (I owned and tested the RONI, KPOS, and Triarii). Some of my readers had greater success with these, depending on the generation of the Glock used, its frame size, and caliber. In general, full-size Gen 3 Glocks in higher velocity calibers were more reliable.

As you noted, the ENDO stock bypasses this weakness.

khadga
08-26-2016, 10:36 AM
Yes, this is the universal weakness with all of these enclosures (I owned and tested the RONI, KPOS, and Triarii). Some of my readers had greater success with these, depending on the generation of the Glock used, its frame size, and caliber. In general, full-size Gen 3 Glocks in higher velocity calibers were more reliable.

As you noted, the ENDO stock bypasses this weakness.

Even after discussing your experience, I wanted the KPOS II to work so badly that a friend and I ran a lot of ammo through several G17/22s and G19/23s. The best reliability we achieved was 2-3 failures every 500 rounds with high quality +p defensive ammo before I gave up on it.

With the rifle caliber SBR options available today, I only want a pistol caliber carbine for fun. I'm happy with a Glock and carbine for everything non-sporting, but proof of the Glock PDW concept will open up a new spot or two in my little arsenal.

bassbones
08-26-2016, 05:39 PM
The kit is like $100..........its a no brainer

JB

WOLF220
08-26-2016, 06:02 PM
This thing just looks cheesy as hell to me. Like if fobus and hi point had a baby, it would look like the roni.

CWBP225
08-26-2016, 07:42 PM
I saw several of these in use in the Philippines with some private security types I worked with. They weren't the RONI brand though, I don't know the model they used. Many folks there could only get a permit for one weapon. So they would use one of these. The slide mounted RMR and Endo/shockwave makes it terribly obsolete, bulky, unwieldy, etc. But in that particular narrow window of circumstances, it seemed to make sense for them, and I saw a few ran pretty well. In practice, their pistol would stay in the holster until outside the city checkpoints, then they would transition it into the contraption and slap in a happy stick for a pdw capability while driving the roads. That was a couple of years ago, hopefully, they have seen the better answer by now.

bassbones
08-27-2016, 07:26 PM
IMI now has a clam.......

JB